I really like Bowman. He's fast, gutsy, and tenacious. Watching him throw lobs to Chriss or just slam it himself is great.
But he is not at an NBA level as of this season. His full court press and transition defense are fine; his half-court defense is lacking. Opponents go around him or shoot over him and he fouls badly. On the other end, his jumper is not good enough from anywhere.
I'd be happy to see him at the end of the bench in spot minutes and garbage time, but I think he'll get run off the floor by good teams so I don't see much beyond that.
I love his hustle and grit. It's just too bad he doesn't really have NBA-level skills to go with them. His handles are really poor, he's relatively short, and doesn't shoot the 3 (or the 2) well. We tend to admire this year's new additions since we're starving for something to like after being spoiled by five straight trips to the Finals. But Bowman's a G-League guy with very little upside playing on a team that won 23 percent of its games this year. I'm guessing he'll bounce around the league a little for a couple of years and then we'll never hear from him again. Perhaps another Matthew Dellavedova who needs a gimmick to stay in the league.
If Bowman's three point percentage is closer to like 35% than the 31% it was by the end of this season, I think he's a better backup PG than Poole. Bowman's free throw percentage gives me reason to believe he's not as bad of a three point shooter as he showed this season after a hot start.
Yh Bowman's shooting started strong but something happened. I think Poole is a more creative playmaker, 3pt shooter (in due time), better off-ball and in iso situations. I do worry about his defense, which I'm more optimistic about with Bowman. But I'd choose Poole because he could potentially be sheltered on defense how Curry is at times. I think Poole's ceiling is higher
I think Bowman has a better handle and knows how to move the ball around better. Definitely seems to project better defensively. It all comes down to if Bowman has a passable pull up three pointer or not.
I'd like to hear more about some of these other spots on your chart. Gallinari, Holiday, Noel? I'm interested. What's your vision for how we can make all those "gets" happen?
For OKC I believe, because they are the ones signing and trading a player. But they probably won't want to go into the luxury because they're not really contending yet. Plus we'll compensate them nicely with Looney. And a pick if necessary
It's good to know we're not tied down with what we have. We can create something incredible for the next few years and smirk in the faces of all the haters who thought the Warriors were done. Here's to hoping the front office pulls off something amazing
Gallinari is a great passer on top of all his other skills. Dray and Chriss are setting screens while Curry and Klay are running off-ball. Gallinari hits Curry or Klay or he takes offense into his own hands. Holiday and Noel are great defenders. Holiday is a high energy off-ball mover who can create his own offence too. Noel is setting screens, rolling, catching lobs on offence, and switching or controlling the paint on D.
Trade Wiggins and Looney to Atlanta. ATL give us a few picks. They'd have a nice lineup with their pick this year. Let's suppose its Trae, Edwards, Wiggins, Collins, Capela. Plus plenty of young high draft talent and plenty of future picks left. That frees up $34 mil for us. Gallinari, Noel, Mahinmi, Holiday are free agents. Bowman's minimum and roster spot goes to Avdija. Nice and simple.
With only $59 mil on their payroll, ATL have the cap space to absorb Wiggins and Looney's contracts next season, ie from 1st July 2020. GSW would create a massive $29 mil and a $5 mil trade exception. Would probably never be used but cap space would be freed up. Gallinari, Noel, Mahinmi and Holiday could then be signed. Correct my logic here if its wrong
Problem 1 is I don't think Atlanta or New York make that trade. I don't think Ender's reputation is rehabilitated that they'd take on that salary AND give up a #1 pick. If I'm Atlanta I just try to sign Gallinari or Holiday (or whoever) instead with that money and not give up a #1 and save $$. But who knows. I guess it's possible.
Problem 2 is actually bigger: Even if they would make the trade, freeing up salary does not help us sign free agents. WIth Steph, Klay and Dray we are already over the cap (or close) and can't sign free agents. We can only trade. That's why we did what we did for D-Lo and then Ender: to keep that salary slot open. But we can only trade for it, not sign free agents. It's also why the Iggy TPE is valuable. Anyway if you trade Ender and get a giant trade exception I think you can still only TRADE for other players so your plan is not feasable short of having Atlanta or NY sign those players and then Trade for Wiggins and that triggers the hard cap, so no.
OK so I'm learning at this stage. Trying to understand all the rules. But New York was the alternative. They have players with team options that make up the money. Plus many picks.
Aha, you’re on the Avdija train! I would think he’s more of a point forward at SF/PF though. At 6’ 9” and not *that* fast I don’t think he can play point...
Avdija was my first selection initially, then I switched to Vassell. Now back to Avdija. Just don't see much room for Vassell anymore. What about Avdija's length, height and towering presence over normal-sized PGs? I think he'd still give most PGs a problem. Plus defensive IQ and help D in this lineup would counter Avdija's slightly slower foot speed
I've only seen a couple of highlight videos, so I don't have a strong opinion. But I'd think someone with his physique has more value guarding SF/PF. In general, teams probably won't guard him with a PG... I'd put a PF on him.
I agree yet with so many other high quality defenders plus our switch everything style, I think his size becomes a plus overall. There'd be few little guys on the squad who other teams would target to get the switch on and attack. Then putting a PF on him means opposing PGs are matched up with our 2-5 and almost all can guard the perimeter capably.
I’m a fan of Bowman and believe that he can develop into our own bench version of Patrick Beverly. They have the same measurements and same motor. PBev became the poster boy for playoffs players (as opposed to reg season players) and as Dray said, we need all the 16 game players we can get.
Just remember that Bev didn’t get his reputation until his mid-late 20s. If we can be patient I think Bowman will have the same value.
So I really like Bowman, especially his motor, but the reality is that neither his D or his O is very good right now (the article points this out). Can/ will he improve those numbers? Can the Warriors afford to wait and see? They can if he will sign another 2-way. Maaaaybe they can if he's the 15th guy and his potential is higher than some other 15th guy (the current situation has the Ws getting 3 picks in the draft). RIght now, Poole seems like a better option at backup PG (he also needs to improve, though.
Bottom line is I think he has to prove it on the court fast as the W's can't really afford to wait for him to hit his mid to late 20s in their current situation. (I hope he does)
I'm banking on how rapidly Poole shifted gear towards the end of the season. I believe he takes another big step forward over the summer. On the other hand, I'm wondering if a true backup PG matters with this team? Many have kicked off the offense Inc Dray, Lee, Toscano, Paschall, Mulder, Wiggins, Steph and Poole. All can do a good job
Do u even know what u are saying? Motion offense needs 3 ball handlers at least.a primary ball handler, a decoy PG and another ball handler. The death lineup had 4. Steph, dray, kd and andre. So they could dump the ball to one person and keep moving. Steph, and dray are the only elite ball handlers on the team. Paschall lacks good ball handling skills. Poole is not ready. He is at best a secondary ball handler and im not even sure he can play well at the pace the team would play. The PG determines the pace and im not sure poole can operate well at that.if we drop to 6 or7 in the draft we can get halliburton who is a natural PG, better shooter than poole and has a 7ft wingspan to partner mulder in the 2nd unit... Lee has good hustle but isnt a PG..Toascano and mulder arent either
I think our points merge. I'm not sure we need another elite PG. We have Steph and Dray. Then we have several others who are capable of moving the ball without having to be Steph or Dray level. And the motion offense can flow with the good passers and capable dribblers on the squad. With one of Steph or Dray on the floor, is a second string amazing PG as necessary on this team as it would be on other teams? It would be nice, but is it needed?
We need another elite PG. In deep playoff runs even draymond become limited as a ball handler. In 2018 houston series. When things got tough even kerr had to make curry more dominant in that series. We need another good PG..
Agreed. Would like to keep Bowman around. Just not ready to give him a roster spot this coming year with so much other talent available and if we're REALLY going on another dynasty run
Patrick Beverly has shot 3s at 38% for his career. Can't see Bowman getting anywhere near that level. If your PG can't shoot the 3, you're going to be in trouble.
I like Bowman, if his three point shot is closer to what it was in the beginning of the season than in the end, he's definitely an NBA player.
I really like Bowman. He's fast, gutsy, and tenacious. Watching him throw lobs to Chriss or just slam it himself is great.
But he is not at an NBA level as of this season. His full court press and transition defense are fine; his half-court defense is lacking. Opponents go around him or shoot over him and he fouls badly. On the other end, his jumper is not good enough from anywhere.
I'd be happy to see him at the end of the bench in spot minutes and garbage time, but I think he'll get run off the floor by good teams so I don't see much beyond that.
By popular demand, I added a poll letting Dub Nation “choose” between CP3 and Harden. The original poll I did is a virtual tie. https://twitter.com/ericapricot/status/1246108256981774338?s=21
I love his hustle and grit. It's just too bad he doesn't really have NBA-level skills to go with them. His handles are really poor, he's relatively short, and doesn't shoot the 3 (or the 2) well. We tend to admire this year's new additions since we're starving for something to like after being spoiled by five straight trips to the Finals. But Bowman's a G-League guy with very little upside playing on a team that won 23 percent of its games this year. I'm guessing he'll bounce around the league a little for a couple of years and then we'll never hear from him again. Perhaps another Matthew Dellavedova who needs a gimmick to stay in the league.
I like Bowman a lot. But looking at the possibilities of roster movement like this:
PG: Steph, Poole, Avdija
SG: Klay, Mulder, Lee
SF: Gallinari, Justin Holiday, Toscano
PF: Dray, Paschall, Smiley
C: Chriss, Noel, Mahinmi
I think Bowman can grow in Santa Cruz for a while if not picked up by another team
If Bowman's three point percentage is closer to like 35% than the 31% it was by the end of this season, I think he's a better backup PG than Poole. Bowman's free throw percentage gives me reason to believe he's not as bad of a three point shooter as he showed this season after a hot start.
Yh Bowman's shooting started strong but something happened. I think Poole is a more creative playmaker, 3pt shooter (in due time), better off-ball and in iso situations. I do worry about his defense, which I'm more optimistic about with Bowman. But I'd choose Poole because he could potentially be sheltered on defense how Curry is at times. I think Poole's ceiling is higher
I think Bowman has a better handle and knows how to move the ball around better. Definitely seems to project better defensively. It all comes down to if Bowman has a passable pull up three pointer or not.
I'd like to hear more about some of these other spots on your chart. Gallinari, Holiday, Noel? I'm interested. What's your vision for how we can make all those "gets" happen?
Check this out:
Move Wiggins: ATL, DET, NYK, CHO can make cap space to absorb his contract. They give us a 1st round pick. $29 mil trade exception created.
Sign Gallinari: OKC sign-and-trade and we use Iggy's trade exception. Give OKC Looney and perhaps a 2nd round pick in return.
Sign Mahinmi: MLE
Sign Holiday: bi-annual exception
Sign Noel: minimum salary
Note: all of these contracts tally to slightly less than Wiggins' $29 mil salary
Doesn't the sign and trade for Gallinari trigger the hard cap again - something I thought management wanted to avoid this upcoming season?
For OKC I believe, because they are the ones signing and trading a player. But they probably won't want to go into the luxury because they're not really contending yet. Plus we'll compensate them nicely with Looney. And a pick if necessary
Plus they'd likely lose Gallinari in free agency and get nothing for him otherwise
I like the possibilities. Good thinking!
It's good to know we're not tied down with what we have. We can create something incredible for the next few years and smirk in the faces of all the haters who thought the Warriors were done. Here's to hoping the front office pulls off something amazing
Gallinari is a great passer on top of all his other skills. Dray and Chriss are setting screens while Curry and Klay are running off-ball. Gallinari hits Curry or Klay or he takes offense into his own hands. Holiday and Noel are great defenders. Holiday is a high energy off-ball mover who can create his own offence too. Noel is setting screens, rolling, catching lobs on offence, and switching or controlling the paint on D.
Trade Wiggins and Looney to Atlanta. ATL give us a few picks. They'd have a nice lineup with their pick this year. Let's suppose its Trae, Edwards, Wiggins, Collins, Capela. Plus plenty of young high draft talent and plenty of future picks left. That frees up $34 mil for us. Gallinari, Noel, Mahinmi, Holiday are free agents. Bowman's minimum and roster spot goes to Avdija. Nice and simple.
How do you make the money work in a trade with ATL? I don't think they're sitting on $30+ million in expiring contracts, right?
With only $59 mil on their payroll, ATL have the cap space to absorb Wiggins and Looney's contracts next season, ie from 1st July 2020. GSW would create a massive $29 mil and a $5 mil trade exception. Would probably never be used but cap space would be freed up. Gallinari, Noel, Mahinmi and Holiday could then be signed. Correct my logic here if its wrong
I think (don't know) you're wrong.
Problem 1 is I don't think Atlanta or New York make that trade. I don't think Ender's reputation is rehabilitated that they'd take on that salary AND give up a #1 pick. If I'm Atlanta I just try to sign Gallinari or Holiday (or whoever) instead with that money and not give up a #1 and save $$. But who knows. I guess it's possible.
Problem 2 is actually bigger: Even if they would make the trade, freeing up salary does not help us sign free agents. WIth Steph, Klay and Dray we are already over the cap (or close) and can't sign free agents. We can only trade. That's why we did what we did for D-Lo and then Ender: to keep that salary slot open. But we can only trade for it, not sign free agents. It's also why the Iggy TPE is valuable. Anyway if you trade Ender and get a giant trade exception I think you can still only TRADE for other players so your plan is not feasable short of having Atlanta or NY sign those players and then Trade for Wiggins and that triggers the hard cap, so no.
OK so I'm learning at this stage. Trying to understand all the rules. But New York was the alternative. They have players with team options that make up the money. Plus many picks.
Aha, you’re on the Avdija train! I would think he’s more of a point forward at SF/PF though. At 6’ 9” and not *that* fast I don’t think he can play point...
Avdija was my first selection initially, then I switched to Vassell. Now back to Avdija. Just don't see much room for Vassell anymore. What about Avdija's length, height and towering presence over normal-sized PGs? I think he'd still give most PGs a problem. Plus defensive IQ and help D in this lineup would counter Avdija's slightly slower foot speed
I've only seen a couple of highlight videos, so I don't have a strong opinion. But I'd think someone with his physique has more value guarding SF/PF. In general, teams probably won't guard him with a PG... I'd put a PF on him.
I agree yet with so many other high quality defenders plus our switch everything style, I think his size becomes a plus overall. There'd be few little guys on the squad who other teams would target to get the switch on and attack. Then putting a PF on him means opposing PGs are matched up with our 2-5 and almost all can guard the perimeter capably.
P. S. Bowman could earn my favour for a spot next season simply because of how well he and Chriss play together
Chriss may not even be a starter..
I’m a fan of Bowman and believe that he can develop into our own bench version of Patrick Beverly. They have the same measurements and same motor. PBev became the poster boy for playoffs players (as opposed to reg season players) and as Dray said, we need all the 16 game players we can get.
Just remember that Bev didn’t get his reputation until his mid-late 20s. If we can be patient I think Bowman will have the same value.
So I really like Bowman, especially his motor, but the reality is that neither his D or his O is very good right now (the article points this out). Can/ will he improve those numbers? Can the Warriors afford to wait and see? They can if he will sign another 2-way. Maaaaybe they can if he's the 15th guy and his potential is higher than some other 15th guy (the current situation has the Ws getting 3 picks in the draft). RIght now, Poole seems like a better option at backup PG (he also needs to improve, though.
Bottom line is I think he has to prove it on the court fast as the W's can't really afford to wait for him to hit his mid to late 20s in their current situation. (I hope he does)
I dont think poole is ready to be a backup PG
I'm banking on how rapidly Poole shifted gear towards the end of the season. I believe he takes another big step forward over the summer. On the other hand, I'm wondering if a true backup PG matters with this team? Many have kicked off the offense Inc Dray, Lee, Toscano, Paschall, Mulder, Wiggins, Steph and Poole. All can do a good job
Do u even know what u are saying? Motion offense needs 3 ball handlers at least.a primary ball handler, a decoy PG and another ball handler. The death lineup had 4. Steph, dray, kd and andre. So they could dump the ball to one person and keep moving. Steph, and dray are the only elite ball handlers on the team. Paschall lacks good ball handling skills. Poole is not ready. He is at best a secondary ball handler and im not even sure he can play well at the pace the team would play. The PG determines the pace and im not sure poole can operate well at that.if we drop to 6 or7 in the draft we can get halliburton who is a natural PG, better shooter than poole and has a 7ft wingspan to partner mulder in the 2nd unit... Lee has good hustle but isnt a PG..Toascano and mulder arent either
I think our points merge. I'm not sure we need another elite PG. We have Steph and Dray. Then we have several others who are capable of moving the ball without having to be Steph or Dray level. And the motion offense can flow with the good passers and capable dribblers on the squad. With one of Steph or Dray on the floor, is a second string amazing PG as necessary on this team as it would be on other teams? It would be nice, but is it needed?
We need another elite PG. In deep playoff runs even draymond become limited as a ball handler. In 2018 houston series. When things got tough even kerr had to make curry more dominant in that series. We need another good PG..
Might be more of a Cory Joseph than a Patrick Beverley, which is fine with me
Agreed. Would like to keep Bowman around. Just not ready to give him a roster spot this coming year with so much other talent available and if we're REALLY going on another dynasty run
Patrick Beverly has shot 3s at 38% for his career. Can't see Bowman getting anywhere near that level. If your PG can't shoot the 3, you're going to be in trouble.