Okay, with this thread overflowing with more than 1K comments, I'm opening a new thread updated with all the GSW free agency news including the Donte news.
Please help move everyone over there. Feel free to use passive-aggression, aggressive-aggression and passive-passivity.
I’ll bet there are lots of teams and individual players that are happy with the news that Payton was signed away from the Warriors and they’ll only have to face him on the Blazers. I would have been terrified to see him in a Grizzlies uniform. Anyone have any thoughts on what team Payton would have made the most difference on? I’m assuming one that values pace like the Warriors. The guy was a fast break machine.
None of the core 3 should be playing more than 32 minutes a game, and ideally they're closer to 30 minutes. I suspect Kuminga and Moody are probably more in the 20-25 minute range. The Warriors are planning to play Wiseman 10-15 minutes, so there's not much point to excluding his likely minutes.
Steph at 36mpg is way too high. Wiggs, Klay, and Dray probably should be a hair lower too... bump Poole/Kuminga/Moody/Wise... and Vincenzo has entered the chat!
Glad for Loon's return, for OPJ and GPII to get paid, for JTA to have another chance in the league, and for Bjeli to return to Europe a champion, ready to star again.
I hate that we lost the guys we lost. I'm sorry we won't get to see them run it back to try to defend the title together. But having lived with the shock and sadness of it for just a few hours, I think things may be better this way.
We're betting an awful lot of the youngsters, but that's as it should be. We have three lottery talents on the bench, in need of game time to grow and take their next steps. Yes, they'll keep being tutored and watching film, but they need to start doing it live and on the court. It is time.
I trust Bob to pull together the supporting pieces. But Moody, Kuminga, and even Wiseman will have to take a step. They have to.
And about those Minny's picks: Gobert and Towns are both AWESOME in the regular season. Barring injury, they're definitely going to be in the play in or better until they have some further roster churn, so the picks are going to be decent, but not great.
Yeah... they *could* try to give him full ownership to rebuild the whole team around him (cuz that's worked out so well for so many teams, lol)... but that won't work either, cuz hasn't he always wanted to be somewhere "sexier" like NYC or Miami?
I don't think it matters what Mitchell wants, with the deal Utah made they are clearly in full tankathon mode and they don't need or want Mitchell to be part of it. By the time they get that 2nd 1st round pick, Mitchell will be at the end of his current deal and can opt out of his last year (25-26). All Mitchell can do for the Jazz until then is make their draft position worse.
Great piece. Coincidentally, I actually just saw another phenomenal piece giving an overview of the Durant/Irving era in Brooklyn, cannot recommend enough:
Jul 1, 2022·edited Jul 1, 2022Liked by Eric Apricot
Perspective on GP2. OK. This all comes down to next season's budget. Assuming Poole gets $120M/4 years, and Wiggs gets $130M/4 years, vet mins to fill out the roster, no draft pick, then next years's projected salary budget will be over $216M, with a tax of $252M, and a total of $468+M.
Their marginal tax multiplier will be 8.25x at that point. This includes a projected 5% increase in salary cap.
Then trade him next season. It's not bloody complicated - an 8/9 million a year deal is laughably easy to move (especially for someone like GP2 who is not gonna be a terrible player).
If they were to trade him next year, wouldn't they have to bring back the same amount in salary? If so, how would that help their luxury tax situation?
Trade him to a team with cap space (usually tanking teams like OKC/ORL/IND will take on salary for draft compensation). For smaller contracts, it's going to be like 1 2nd round pick or two.
I got it. I always thought the allure of an expiring was what drove teams to take on the contract. But I get it... basically, "here's a set of picks for essentially $9M for the two remaining years" or something like that.
Yeah, that makes sense why they were trying to restrict GP2 to a single year. If Wiggs agrees to 130/4, it can't be an extension - will have to wait until next offseason.
What would be wrong with that? I heard you couldn't drop annual salary too much, but couldn't you do even salary across the board or salary decreases or something.
Sounds like people are now expecting Mitchell to ask for a trade out of Utah (although no immediate indications of that as of yet). Miami keeps being floated as the most likely trade partner. Hmm... if only Miami had any close ties with someone who's a part owner of the Jazz...
Yet when it comes to Payton, this is the kind of move that will surely make Lillard smile. Not only does he desperately need elite wing defenders at his side, but Lillard is close with Payton’s father, Gary Payton, the Hall of Fame point guard and fellow Oakland, Calif., native who has helped mentor him for years now.
What’s more, Payton II, his father and Lillard have all been repped by the same agent, Aaron Goodwin of Goodwin Sports Management. There’s the Northwest tie-in for Payton II too, as he was beloved in his two years at Oregon State (2014-16).
The Warriors’ loss, in other words, is the Trail Blazers’ gain as they attempt to keep the Lillard era alive.
Okay, with this thread overflowing with more than 1K comments, I'm opening a new thread updated with all the GSW free agency news including the Donte news.
Please help move everyone over there. Feel free to use passive-aggression, aggressive-aggression and passive-passivity.
https://dubnationhq.com/p/free-agency-day-2-emotional-processing?sd=pf
Donte is a 2 time NCAA champ. Bob found us another winner for a great value.
White. Donte. Let's go.
Which White are we talking about?
White?
It seems that way, lol.
as in a player named White, or just pointing out that DiVincenzo is white? I'm confused lol
it’s his nickname
thank you 😅
I’ll bet there are lots of teams and individual players that are happy with the news that Payton was signed away from the Warriors and they’ll only have to face him on the Blazers. I would have been terrified to see him in a Grizzlies uniform. Anyone have any thoughts on what team Payton would have made the most difference on? I’m assuming one that values pace like the Warriors. The guy was a fast break machine.
Thinking through who we have and what a minutes distribution might look like per position in the regular season next year:
PG: 36 Steph, 12 Poole
SG: 20 Klay, 18 Poole, 10 moody
SF: 30 wiggs, 12 Klay, 6 moody
PF: 24 dray, 18 kuminga, 6 wiggs
C: 24 loon, 8 dray, 16 ???
Without bjeli or OPJ, definitely need another 4/5 so we don’t have to count on Wiseman.
Per player totals:
Steph: 36
Wiggs: 36
Klay: 32
Dray: 32
Poole: 30
Loon: 24
Kuminga: 18
Moody: 18
That doesn’t feel crazy or overly reliant on the kids
None of the core 3 should be playing more than 32 minutes a game, and ideally they're closer to 30 minutes. I suspect Kuminga and Moody are probably more in the 20-25 minute range. The Warriors are planning to play Wiseman 10-15 minutes, so there's not much point to excluding his likely minutes.
Steph at 36mpg is way too high. Wiggs, Klay, and Dray probably should be a hair lower too... bump Poole/Kuminga/Moody/Wise... and Vincenzo has entered the chat!
Well, you Donte fans are in for a treat....2/9.3 per Woj/Shams.
Beverley is always saying nice things about Steph and the Ws. Could totally see him jumping on the Ws fun boat if the Jazz buy him out.
Why would the jazz buy him out? He's gotta be a tradeable asset on that contract...
could totally see Kerr losinG his mind on the sidelines
😂
Glad for Loon's return, for OPJ and GPII to get paid, for JTA to have another chance in the league, and for Bjeli to return to Europe a champion, ready to star again.
I hate that we lost the guys we lost. I'm sorry we won't get to see them run it back to try to defend the title together. But having lived with the shock and sadness of it for just a few hours, I think things may be better this way.
We're betting an awful lot of the youngsters, but that's as it should be. We have three lottery talents on the bench, in need of game time to grow and take their next steps. Yes, they'll keep being tutored and watching film, but they need to start doing it live and on the court. It is time.
I trust Bob to pull together the supporting pieces. But Moody, Kuminga, and even Wiseman will have to take a step. They have to.
They will.
Maybe Miami does really want to involve Mitchell, but as part of a 3-team trade for Durant?
So... who's doing the best in free agency so far? Seems like:
1) Celtics
2) Portland?
3) Utah
4) whoever gets KD (without Kyrie?)
Utah's offseason is super incomplete...
And about those Minny's picks: Gobert and Towns are both AWESOME in the regular season. Barring injury, they're definitely going to be in the play in or better until they have some further roster churn, so the picks are going to be decent, but not great.
AE will keep improving, too. I could see them in seeds 4-7 next year.
Exactly... Even DLo will be more useful because he'll have:
1. Gobert protecting the rim for him
2. Actual willingness to pass the ball to Gobert
Andy Larsen [Jazz beat writer]
@andyblarsen
FWIW: I'm hearing some pushback regarding the idea that the Jazz are definitely keeping Donovan Mitchell moving forward.
Sense is that the Jazz are keeping their options open here: they could retool around Mitchell, or trade him for a massive haul to jumpstart a rebuild.
3:12 PM · Jul 1, 2022
He's getting traded, we all know it.
Yeah... they *could* try to give him full ownership to rebuild the whole team around him (cuz that's worked out so well for so many teams, lol)... but that won't work either, cuz hasn't he always wanted to be somewhere "sexier" like NYC or Miami?
I don't think it matters what Mitchell wants, with the deal Utah made they are clearly in full tankathon mode and they don't need or want Mitchell to be part of it. By the time they get that 2nd 1st round pick, Mitchell will be at the end of his current deal and can opt out of his last year (25-26). All Mitchell can do for the Jazz until then is make their draft position worse.
https://theathletic.com/3393222/2022/07/01/kd-trade-nets-joseph-tsai/
Good overview of the Durant -Irving era in Brooklyn.
Great piece. Coincidentally, I actually just saw another phenomenal piece giving an overview of the Durant/Irving era in Brooklyn, cannot recommend enough:
https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/OWzTLUdHHc2GkOaFQ8WmerJzPOI=/139x0:2360x1666/1200x800/filters:focal(139x0:2360x1666)/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_image/image/55911395/1_XtZ2hlKywd2vA-yHnOL4DQ.0.jpeg
Beautiful prose.
😎
😂
Perspective on GP2. OK. This all comes down to next season's budget. Assuming Poole gets $120M/4 years, and Wiggs gets $130M/4 years, vet mins to fill out the roster, no draft pick, then next years's projected salary budget will be over $216M, with a tax of $252M, and a total of $468+M.
Their marginal tax multiplier will be 8.25x at that point. This includes a projected 5% increase in salary cap.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1JKTDRR_YbjX8S_xebph8qIEDd6b1-dBvlbeUHc1lD04/edit?usp=sharing
In other words, $9M for GP2 next year would be $60+M additional, for almost $530+M
Then trade him next season. It's not bloody complicated - an 8/9 million a year deal is laughably easy to move (especially for someone like GP2 who is not gonna be a terrible player).
If they were to trade him next year, wouldn't they have to bring back the same amount in salary? If so, how would that help their luxury tax situation?
Trade him to a team with cap space (usually tanking teams like OKC/ORL/IND will take on salary for draft compensation). For smaller contracts, it's going to be like 1 2nd round pick or two.
Right but why would a tanking team want him just to give up draft picks? Also, aren't salary dumps typically for guys with 1 year left?
The tanking team would want him to acquire the draft compensation (if it is a negative contract).
And salary dumps can be for whatever years.
Wait, but what about the incoming salary? Wouldn't we have to take something back that close enough to the outgoing salary?
I got it. I always thought the allure of an expiring was what drove teams to take on the contract. But I get it... basically, "here's a set of picks for essentially $9M for the two remaining years" or something like that.
I would like to know as well. Not to mention if GP2 gets injured or has a down year... then what?
Yeah, that makes sense why they were trying to restrict GP2 to a single year. If Wiggs agrees to 130/4, it can't be an extension - will have to wait until next offseason.
What would be wrong with that? I heard you couldn't drop annual salary too much, but couldn't you do even salary across the board or salary decreases or something.
Oh, b/c it's a salary cut? Can't extend at a lower salary point?
Shesh that’s as much as hitting a big CA Lottery.
So the ownership spends the equivalent of hitting it big on the Mega Millions every year on the roster.
Sounds like people are now expecting Mitchell to ask for a trade out of Utah (although no immediate indications of that as of yet). Miami keeps being floated as the most likely trade partner. Hmm... if only Miami had any close ties with someone who's a part owner of the Jazz...
Insight from Sam Amick on GPII to Portland:
Yet when it comes to Payton, this is the kind of move that will surely make Lillard smile. Not only does he desperately need elite wing defenders at his side, but Lillard is close with Payton’s father, Gary Payton, the Hall of Fame point guard and fellow Oakland, Calif., native who has helped mentor him for years now.
What’s more, Payton II, his father and Lillard have all been repped by the same agent, Aaron Goodwin of Goodwin Sports Management. There’s the Northwest tie-in for Payton II too, as he was beloved in his two years at Oregon State (2014-16).
The Warriors’ loss, in other words, is the Trail Blazers’ gain as they attempt to keep the Lillard era alive.
😭
NBA teams going full 2K. Trading mediocre players along with tons of picks for the best player they can get.