Weird thought experiment: if Lonzo Ball suddenly woke up tomorrow with a 7’1” wingspan and magically became a 1-5-switchable, defensive specialist, how big of a contract would you offer him?
I understand everyone loves the status quo. Imagine if monta wasn't traded would there be any dynasty? Monta was a very good player but they had to move on from him .. I believe the benefits of moving on from draymond far outweigh the risks
Unless you mean the on-hold dynasty, which is what theoretically still exists when Steph and Klay and Dray play together again next season. In that case, yes, we all friggin’ adore the status quo! Don’t mess with it! Also known as championship core.
Between God and Man I'm actually Steph's fan. They basketball warriors played in those 3 years were one of the best ever. Draymond destroyed it because of some juvenile behaviour and you know the worst thing. He hasn't changed. Do u think Giannis is watching and wants to be a part of that? We all saw what he did to KD on national TV. Giannis will want to come and have draymond shout at him. If Steph takes it Giannis is going to beat draymond such that his mom don't recognise him, Giannis is an African where respect is reciprocal..
I'm a man. If someone said that nonsense to me I will leave too. Superstars have big egos. Draymond is a role player. If warriors wanted to keep KD they should have traded draymond straight away. Jabari Parker was traded because Giannis didn't like him. Dennis Smith jr was traded because Luka didn't get along with him. Curry will understand. If draymond was in Currys position do u think he would care about him. I actuallynlost respect for him when I heard the nonsense he told swaggy P about curry. He knows most nba players don't respect curry not because he isn't better than them but because his daddy had money. Yet u start liking him to someone with Tourette when he isn't making shots.For someone who has been doubted all his life. Do u know the level of hard work to get him to that level. Yet u can joke about him,with a casual like swaggy P who doesn't know what it takes to be great..lets be frank draymond is the reason Curry doesn't have a FMVP till today.
You probably think this is a hot take but I think the Warriors +Dray -KD is a better team than +KD -Dray. It doesn’t mean I think Dray is a better player. It just means I think the equation is a lot more dynamic than it looks.
yeah see how that aged in the finals last year. Draymond is the reason we need 3 max players because he just can't score.even if he isn't a 3pt shooter. Have a midrange game. But no he wont.Shawn Livingston probably never shot up,to 10 3pt throughout his warriors career.Draymond has no go to jumpshot..All he does is hang out with celebrities. He was training with Brandon Payne in 2016. Him and Harrison Barnes. Somehow he shot 38% that season and left ..brandon Payne has been training curry since 2011 I think. That's his skills trainer.
What happened last playoffs against Houston when Steph wasn't playing well.Didnt Draymond' s mom go on Twitter mocking him with some cachectic picture. Didn't she remember that Steph is the reason her son is a champion and has 3 all star appearances. If dray was playing next to harden or Westbrook do u think he can even average 3 assists? Will he get to even touch the ball enough to have an all star claim?I'm just being objective. Draymond s antics are detrimental to the team. Is he a good player? Yes. Is he an awesome player. No. Is he worth 25m per year.? Hell no. PJ Tucker earns 7m per year .. compare what he does to draymond and tell me draymond is worth 25m.with that money we can get 2 players that will collectively have more impact on both ends of the floor than draymond..
In my opinion, if you switch them, the Rockets win at least one series with the dubs. Point Dray would have complimented CP3 so well, even without the 3pt shooting. Different offenses, I know, but still. Who do you replace Dray with/trade him for that replaces his playmaking, BBIQ, and defense?
All those qualities you mentioned also apply to Andre right. Maybe you should watch him as he gets cooked on nightly basis in Miami heat. Wait for it. They are playing mavs tonight be sure to watch bbq chicken Andre tonight. All those defense, bball IQ thing are only of value when u have elite shot makers who can turn the slightest advantage into points. Haven't u watched KD talk about warriors love for chaos plays. Cos they want to rack up points before the defense is set..coach Pop has a famous quote that it's absolute death to turn the ball over to the warriors in transition.. on teams without elite shot makers those bb IQ stuffs don't translate
Andre won't be able to keep up Dray in foot race. They are different type of play makers, defenders and plus, Dray is 5 years younger. Dray leading fast break is a thing of beauty.
As far as KD goes, 90% of his body was already out the door. Dray just pushed a bit while hoping to pull him back.
Do u think draymond would even be allowed to playmake on the rockets? Even cp3 wasn't getting enough of the ball. You think draymond can be this useful in an iso system?.. think again
You clearly have no idea about the ways Draymond adds value to a team including Steph and Klay, on both sides of the court. I suggest you look at some footage from prior seasons and focus on his passing, his defensive positioning, and his floor general vision and play calling. He’s the closest thing I’ve seen to a player coach in the modern NBA.
I know all that. Put the ball in other players hands and let's see if they won't pass it. Basketball is about points. U can't pay a player 25m and tell me he isn't a scorer.. maybe steph should stop scoring and lets say he gets paid 40m because of his gravity. Or because he has size limitations he should just go cold on defense and say his job isn't to defend. Most warriors fans are delusional in truth.. To be ahead u have to think ahead. Don't keep thinking about some shit he did in the past that he hasn't reproduced in 2yrs. Player coach that gets ejected in the middle of a game when he knows the rookies need him. Imagine if Steph did something like that.. game 6 against Houston last playoffs when Steph was having a bad night. The foul against PJ Tucker was questionable. Maybe he should have thrown a tantrum too and get himself ejected because the seat got too hot.its because of fans like you that dray became a raving lunatic he is. All the talk that dray is a winner. Some fans even said he is the reason we started winning. How many games has he won for us now without the splash brothers?. EVEN Rudy Gobert who has a far more impact than dray defensively is averaging 15ppg but dray is allowed to average 8points because some people believe his job is not to score.
You think the offense and defense are the sum of measurable parts, but the great secret to GS’s winning formula is that Steph, Klay and Dray are more than that because their skills are so complimentary. I’ll take an order of Green Curry in a Klay pot any day!
Draymond's skill in that dynamic is easily replaceable..most players can develop PG passing skills. Not everyone can be a 40+ % career 3pt shooter like curry and klay. What u don't understand is that the trio Is underutilized their potential because draymond can't shoot. Defenses know all he does is make a pass. Now allow a competent shooter to run that offense too and then it becomes impossible to guard.
I don't want to just sound mean, so let me clarify:
Draymond's passing skills are elite, i.e. not easily replaceable.
His play-making (not the same as scoring) skills are also elite.
His ability to read both the offense and the defense of the other team is at the highest level imaginable.
And though he is not the most athletic player on the team, his ability to switch on D is, though not as rare as it used to be, still pretty rare.
When a player has all that, he is a very important piece to a particular kind of team. Say, one that has the best ever shooting point guard and a high defense elite shooting 2 guard, and is particularly adept at going small.
I already made the mistake of writing off Iguodala 2+ years early, and Dray doesn't even turn 30 until next month. Even when he declines athletically, Dray will still have his BBIQ and length, not to mention his ability to quarterback both offense and defense when needed. If he's washed at age 33 (his last contract year) and doesn't want to take a paycut, then we have a decision to make. But until then, he's undeniably an asset, especially during the playoffs. This year is a bad way to judge anyone on the Warriors, especially one that's been critical to all 3 finals wins. ANd that doesn't even count the in and out-of-game coaching he does with players like Chriss.
A harder question (at least for me): Who's the worst player you'd include Dray in a package for?
For me, any player who's a former MVP and is still in their prime (or possibly future MVP - say, Luka or Zion) you don't hesitate, but beyond that . . . even a rediculous package of future draft picks from a team like the Cavs probably wouldn't do it, because we have the splash bros' primes to think about.
If I'm the front office, I don't even answer the phone about a Draymond trade package unless the offer includes an All-Star, All-NBA caliber player, in or approaching their prime. Giannis, Embiid, Luka... that kinda guy. Basically, if the trade wouldn't have the rest of the league giving up and declaring the dubs an unbeatable superteam like when we got KD, it's not worth giving up Dray. And honestly, even getting a guy of that caliber probably wouldn't put us back on that pedestal if we had to lose Dray to get him.
Isn't Westbrook a former MVP still in his prime? Russ is probably underrated at this point but I still think Green is better alongside Steph, worst case about even.
One thing unfolding before our eyes is draymond destroying warriors culture. He is a bad leader for these young lads. How can u tell quese not to push Doncic when all draymond does is cuss the referees. I feel he is overrated and honestly doesn't contribute much to scoring and mostly gets hockey assists. He has single Handedly harmed this team more any other player. I don't know the leverage his defense gives that they can't flip him. We always talked about Andrew's defense till he got to Miami and is now getting exposed on nightly basis. Most of those guys just benefitted from being around the 3 best shot makers in the league..Draymond will end up in China within 2 yrs if the warriors trade him. Yet he behaves like he is the reason the team is in existence. Dude is making 38% FG and 26% 3pt yet all he does is go to Vegas for some fight or go to the Grammy. I seriously question his commitment. We all saw how impotenten our attack was after klay went down because nobody could make shots..nobody guards draymond at the 3pt line yet he never feels motivated to improve, all he brags about is some championship that he happened to have been carried to
Feb 28, 2020Liked by punk basketball, Daniel Hardee
Slim, man I am sorry but I have to disagree with most everything you said.
I am not sure where you get hockey assists from a guy averaging 7 assists per game the last 5 years. If you don't see how he impacts the game you are not looking close enough- or you don't watch the playoffs. I would say Draymond ending up in China is the most preposterous of your statements, but then you questioned the guys commitment. That's ridiculous man. The guy puts everything he can into his game with the tools he has as an undersized big who not only runs the offense but also the defense. When they say the guy has a genius mind for basketball it is because of how he thinks about the game. To understand Draymond's impact takes a little effort if you are not used to recognizing it.
C'mon man... you can't get mad at Dray in a tank season. 3 championships, 5 straight finals in the last 5 seasons. Going in to this game without Wigs and Steph - there was zero chance it would even be close. It's a good game to evaluate the youngsters, and to see what the big Dragon Bender can do. (so far, he's not doing much... but he's got an interesting, Joe Harris-type of catch and shoot 3pt game that I'd like to see more )
Bender has not been a good basketball player so far. But he's only 22. He can shoot 3s, and he's 7 ft 1. He's got tools to become a good basketball player. That's the luxury of having no-bearing games in a tank season. Kerr and Bob can bring in some projects to evaluate and see if they can contribute next season.
IF Bender can play better defense and pass, he could play that high-post on offense and facilitate. That's what these tank games are good for.
You're the same guy strongly advocating for dumping NBA champ, and former defensive player of the year, Draymond Green for Aaron Gordon, whose biggest claim to fame is being awesome in the dunk contest?
Just because Dray is emotional, and pouty sometimes doesn't take anything away from how critical he's been for this franchise. It's weird to me that "defense is half the game" is such a famous saying, and yet so many people are more than happy to completely ignore it (probably because offensive numbers are so much easier to convert into counting stats).
I'm glad you said former DPOY. The fact that he on it then doesn't mean his impact hasn't atrociously reduced that they can't move on from him. Hope you know his inability to shoot at a high clip creates spacing problems. Aaron Gordon may only be know for his dunking but u won't fail to admit that he is a better scorer than draymond. You also can't just back off him at the 3pt line. Its also a known fact that one of the most unfortunate things in basketball is to try to defend curry one on one. Having a PF like AG creates more of those one on one scenarios. Also iOS the defensive impact of draymond huge enough to mitigate his inability to score.? For all I know Rudy Gobert is a 2x Dpoy yet he averages more points every year than draymond at a higher efficiency. In the end he that scores the most points get to win the game.Having someone like draymond wh doesnt score put enormous pressure on the splash brothers to score. Andre used to make few defensive stop and end up with +20 on the box score. Now in Miami how come he still makes those few defensive stops and end up being the outlier with -33 on the box SCORE?
Steph hasn't won MVP for years. He's only shooting 24% from deep this season. You done with him too?
My core point here is that sample size matters, and the importance of the game matters.
We do not have Dray on this team to score points, and the VAST majority of his career here has been excellent. I respect your right to have your own opinion, but I'm not swayed just yet that Draymond is any sort of anchor that's holding the franchise down.
There is. You don't quit on your team. What precedence is he laying for the young players. Steph and klay never quit on their team members even though they did the heavy lifting. That's why we were able to comeback and win playoff series against OKC and Houston... Even Steve kerr mentioned that the team needed him so badly yesterday. Draymond is full of antics. People said he was more important than klay. I personally believe we need a taller PF that can playmake,shoot and score like Aaron Gordon to replace draymond. We can't win championships anymore with draymond unless he relearn how to shoot. Defenders are backing off him and doubling curry. He doesn't help spacing at all..
Wow. Not even any credit for Draymond during the championship years? His defensive chops allowed the team to run a small ball unit and popularized the switching defense. His vision and ball-handling solved the Curry trap allowing for easy buckets in a 4-on-3 situation. Duby Dub Dubs tweeted out a stat recently that Draymond average assists per 100 hasn't dipped much even when surrounded by below average perimeter shooters. If Draymond could shoot, he would be the best player in the league.
Which vision. Didn't Andre and Shawn run those 4 on 3 mismatches too?Give the ball to Aaron Gordon in those 4 on 3 situations and let's see if he wouldn't run it. Also people forget the effect of his salary on the cap space. You really want to give 25mullion of cap per year to a player who averages a triple single? Tell me the last time draymond has locked down a perimeter threat. It was klay and Andre locking down harden, Westbrook and kwahi while draymond would hide behind and bark orders like a drill sergeant.. I thought great defensive players used to relish taking the toughest defensive assignments?. It was klay and Andre doing that..
I definitely agree that Draymond needs to be a 3pt threat. He needs to be at least a 35% 3pt shooter that teams cannot just leave open on purpose. That wide-open 3pt set shot of 35% accuracy is the most easily achievable goal for him because all he needs to do is shoot 200 3s in practice every day. No reason why he can't achieve this especially since he has done it before.
Aaron Gordon would be nice, but let's be honest. Gordon hasn't proven anything. He hasn't won a playoff series yet. Do we know AG can guard the likes of Anthony Davis and switch to the likes of Lebron or Westbrook? During those playoff victories against the Rockets, Draymond was guarding both Clint Capela AND helping on the guard penetration. Draymond has that pitbull a-hole personality that you need to win big playoff games. Maybe Gordon has it, buy maybe he doesn't. I like AG by the way. That off-the-side-backboard alleyoop twisting one-hand scoop dunk defies physics.
All the respect to Draymond for what he's done for the Warriors over the years... That being said, I do think that he, the Warriors organization and the fanbase should himself/him to a higher standard though - to lead the league in techs (14 along with Westbrook) given how many games he's missed and given the fat contract he just signed should not be acceptable, tank year or not.
And where's the Draymond who said the stuff below back in November:
"I'm going back to the way I was pre-KD, and that's exciting to me. I had to give up shots to make sure Kevin [Durant] gets his touches, and I don't regret that. It got me a couple of championships. But as a competitor, as someone who's still in his prime, who's been in the gym all summer trying to improve my game, it's exciting to know that I can go back to playing the way that I was playing before.
You haven't seen the best of me. I'm definitely not at my peak. I have so much room to grow, new heights that I can reach -- like becoming a 40% 3-point shooter. That'd be amazing, right? My shooting dropped off the last couple of seasons, but it's tough when you're taking only two or three 3s a game. My percentages were a lot higher when I took more."
Don't you know that he is just lying to everyone. He has no offensive game without curry. After saying that he gave up shots to KD, now with plethora of shots to go around he is shooting a whooping 26% 3pt and 38% FG. Mind you his FG% was 45 % in the season he said he gave up shots to KD..Now his new lie is that he isn't taking this season seriously and he is preparing for next season..Even the bulls had to reload after the first 3peat.Draymond is just tricking everyone. I hope the warriors F.O will open their eyes and see.there is a serious spacing issue on that team with his lack of shooting.
Sorry, we can't share pics in chat comments (yet!) here, but this comment made me do a little leg work to try and understand Dray's shooting over the course of his career.
I'll put this in the next preview (tomorrow) but take a look at the shape of his 3pt% in the graphic
and let's have a real talk about a realistic target for Green's outside shot. I'm not sure what "getting his shot back" looks like at this point, but getting back above 35% would be a major victory imo
Read the comment above this one. Check out his performance in game 7 of the 2015/16 finals- 32 points on 15FGA, 15 rebounds, 9 assists & 2 steals- or really just look at his playoff performances. Dray is a winner. It's strange that a dubs fan would be so hostile to him, but then again, maybe you aren't that
One game 4 yrs ago. I'm sure if Michel Jordan based his career on the 1993 nba finals and didn't remind people what he could do going foward it would be easy to call him the GOAT. Tell me what curry averaged in each finals and how his ppg increased in each final..draymond should easily be able to to this especially since nobody guards him..also tell me another time he has had this type of game in the last 3yrs..
In the previous two comments you've handwaved away a sterling performance in a finals game 7 and last year's entire (undermanned) Western Conference Finals series. You're not making a real effort to sound serious here.
I think congrats is in order LGW staff. Is this our first troll?
Man, it just sounds like you haven't watched the playoff games. Draymond has dominated so many tough matchups over the years in those games, including the truly bizarre mismatch of AD in 2018.
Yeah, I don't think the team is much worse in any particular quarter this year. They're very versatile in which quarter happens to be the one that makes you want to gouge out your eyeballs.
It sucks, but I can't believe anyone is counting. This whole season has been about trying to find guys to turn into future resources -- either coming off the bench or tradeable for draft picks. It's been a mess. But player development has gone mostly well, except perhaps in the case of DeAngelo Russell; he grew a bit but not nearly enough and ended up getting traded.
When Steph returns, it'll be about seeing how he, Wiggins, and Dray blend. We'll also get to see how the younger guys fare with Steph's gravity changing the spacing on the court. Not quite a championship run, but you take what you can get...
Even deeper, this is probably the worst Warriors roster I can remember - ok, maybe some of those mid 80's teams, but I was young enough to not properly appreciate how bad my local bad basketball team was
I would rank the '99 team with the big free agent signing of Mookie Blaylock high up there as one of the worst teams I've seen. The most memorable moment was old man Terry Cummings hitting a corner three. He finished the season shooting 100% from three.
Weird thought experiment: if Lonzo Ball suddenly woke up tomorrow with a 7’1” wingspan and magically became a 1-5-switchable, defensive specialist, how big of a contract would you offer him?
I understand everyone loves the status quo. Imagine if monta wasn't traded would there be any dynasty? Monta was a very good player but they had to move on from him .. I believe the benefits of moving on from draymond far outweigh the risks
There is no status quo right now, lol
Unless you mean the on-hold dynasty, which is what theoretically still exists when Steph and Klay and Dray play together again next season. In that case, yes, we all friggin’ adore the status quo! Don’t mess with it! Also known as championship core.
Between God and Man I'm actually Steph's fan. They basketball warriors played in those 3 years were one of the best ever. Draymond destroyed it because of some juvenile behaviour and you know the worst thing. He hasn't changed. Do u think Giannis is watching and wants to be a part of that? We all saw what he did to KD on national TV. Giannis will want to come and have draymond shout at him. If Steph takes it Giannis is going to beat draymond such that his mom don't recognise him, Giannis is an African where respect is reciprocal..
I'm a man. If someone said that nonsense to me I will leave too. Superstars have big egos. Draymond is a role player. If warriors wanted to keep KD they should have traded draymond straight away. Jabari Parker was traded because Giannis didn't like him. Dennis Smith jr was traded because Luka didn't get along with him. Curry will understand. If draymond was in Currys position do u think he would care about him. I actuallynlost respect for him when I heard the nonsense he told swaggy P about curry. He knows most nba players don't respect curry not because he isn't better than them but because his daddy had money. Yet u start liking him to someone with Tourette when he isn't making shots.For someone who has been doubted all his life. Do u know the level of hard work to get him to that level. Yet u can joke about him,with a casual like swaggy P who doesn't know what it takes to be great..lets be frank draymond is the reason Curry doesn't have a FMVP till today.
You probably think this is a hot take but I think the Warriors +Dray -KD is a better team than +KD -Dray. It doesn’t mean I think Dray is a better player. It just means I think the equation is a lot more dynamic than it looks.
yeah see how that aged in the finals last year. Draymond is the reason we need 3 max players because he just can't score.even if he isn't a 3pt shooter. Have a midrange game. But no he wont.Shawn Livingston probably never shot up,to 10 3pt throughout his warriors career.Draymond has no go to jumpshot..All he does is hang out with celebrities. He was training with Brandon Payne in 2016. Him and Harrison Barnes. Somehow he shot 38% that season and left ..brandon Payne has been training curry since 2011 I think. That's his skills trainer.
One thing I think we can all agree on: the front office should always be on the lookout for the next Dray-like player, be it in the draft, FA, etc.
Eric Paschall might be able to become a bargain bin second team version
What happened last playoffs against Houston when Steph wasn't playing well.Didnt Draymond' s mom go on Twitter mocking him with some cachectic picture. Didn't she remember that Steph is the reason her son is a champion and has 3 all star appearances. If dray was playing next to harden or Westbrook do u think he can even average 3 assists? Will he get to even touch the ball enough to have an all star claim?I'm just being objective. Draymond s antics are detrimental to the team. Is he a good player? Yes. Is he an awesome player. No. Is he worth 25m per year.? Hell no. PJ Tucker earns 7m per year .. compare what he does to draymond and tell me draymond is worth 25m.with that money we can get 2 players that will collectively have more impact on both ends of the floor than draymond..
In my opinion, if you switch them, the Rockets win at least one series with the dubs. Point Dray would have complimented CP3 so well, even without the 3pt shooting. Different offenses, I know, but still. Who do you replace Dray with/trade him for that replaces his playmaking, BBIQ, and defense?
All those qualities you mentioned also apply to Andre right. Maybe you should watch him as he gets cooked on nightly basis in Miami heat. Wait for it. They are playing mavs tonight be sure to watch bbq chicken Andre tonight. All those defense, bball IQ thing are only of value when u have elite shot makers who can turn the slightest advantage into points. Haven't u watched KD talk about warriors love for chaos plays. Cos they want to rack up points before the defense is set..coach Pop has a famous quote that it's absolute death to turn the ball over to the warriors in transition.. on teams without elite shot makers those bb IQ stuffs don't translate
Andre won't be able to keep up Dray in foot race. They are different type of play makers, defenders and plus, Dray is 5 years younger. Dray leading fast break is a thing of beauty.
As far as KD goes, 90% of his body was already out the door. Dray just pushed a bit while hoping to pull him back.
First, Andre and Draymond, despite phonetically sharing a syllable, are different players. Second, refer to first.
Do u think draymond would even be allowed to playmake on the rockets? Even cp3 wasn't getting enough of the ball. You think draymond can be this useful in an iso system?.. think again
You clearly have no idea about the ways Draymond adds value to a team including Steph and Klay, on both sides of the court. I suggest you look at some footage from prior seasons and focus on his passing, his defensive positioning, and his floor general vision and play calling. He’s the closest thing I’ve seen to a player coach in the modern NBA.
I know all that. Put the ball in other players hands and let's see if they won't pass it. Basketball is about points. U can't pay a player 25m and tell me he isn't a scorer.. maybe steph should stop scoring and lets say he gets paid 40m because of his gravity. Or because he has size limitations he should just go cold on defense and say his job isn't to defend. Most warriors fans are delusional in truth.. To be ahead u have to think ahead. Don't keep thinking about some shit he did in the past that he hasn't reproduced in 2yrs. Player coach that gets ejected in the middle of a game when he knows the rookies need him. Imagine if Steph did something like that.. game 6 against Houston last playoffs when Steph was having a bad night. The foul against PJ Tucker was questionable. Maybe he should have thrown a tantrum too and get himself ejected because the seat got too hot.its because of fans like you that dray became a raving lunatic he is. All the talk that dray is a winner. Some fans even said he is the reason we started winning. How many games has he won for us now without the splash brothers?. EVEN Rudy Gobert who has a far more impact than dray defensively is averaging 15ppg but dray is allowed to average 8points because some people believe his job is not to score.
You think the offense and defense are the sum of measurable parts, but the great secret to GS’s winning formula is that Steph, Klay and Dray are more than that because their skills are so complimentary. I’ll take an order of Green Curry in a Klay pot any day!
Draymond's skill in that dynamic is easily replaceable..most players can develop PG passing skills. Not everyone can be a 40+ % career 3pt shooter like curry and klay. What u don't understand is that the trio Is underutilized their potential because draymond can't shoot. Defenses know all he does is make a pass. Now allow a competent shooter to run that offense too and then it becomes impossible to guard.
You are out of your depth, kid, and you need to take a class in, or read up on, active listening.
I don't want to just sound mean, so let me clarify:
Draymond's passing skills are elite, i.e. not easily replaceable.
His play-making (not the same as scoring) skills are also elite.
His ability to read both the offense and the defense of the other team is at the highest level imaginable.
And though he is not the most athletic player on the team, his ability to switch on D is, though not as rare as it used to be, still pretty rare.
When a player has all that, he is a very important piece to a particular kind of team. Say, one that has the best ever shooting point guard and a high defense elite shooting 2 guard, and is particularly adept at going small.
I already made the mistake of writing off Iguodala 2+ years early, and Dray doesn't even turn 30 until next month. Even when he declines athletically, Dray will still have his BBIQ and length, not to mention his ability to quarterback both offense and defense when needed. If he's washed at age 33 (his last contract year) and doesn't want to take a paycut, then we have a decision to make. But until then, he's undeniably an asset, especially during the playoffs. This year is a bad way to judge anyone on the Warriors, especially one that's been critical to all 3 finals wins. ANd that doesn't even count the in and out-of-game coaching he does with players like Chriss.
A harder question (at least for me): Who's the worst player you'd include Dray in a package for?
For me, any player who's a former MVP and is still in their prime (or possibly future MVP - say, Luka or Zion) you don't hesitate, but beyond that . . . even a rediculous package of future draft picks from a team like the Cavs probably wouldn't do it, because we have the splash bros' primes to think about.
If I'm the front office, I don't even answer the phone about a Draymond trade package unless the offer includes an All-Star, All-NBA caliber player, in or approaching their prime. Giannis, Embiid, Luka... that kinda guy. Basically, if the trade wouldn't have the rest of the league giving up and declaring the dubs an unbeatable superteam like when we got KD, it's not worth giving up Dray. And honestly, even getting a guy of that caliber probably wouldn't put us back on that pedestal if we had to lose Dray to get him.
Isn't Westbrook a former MVP still in his prime? Russ is probably underrated at this point but I still think Green is better alongside Steph, worst case about even.
People are really mad at Draymond? Smh.
Who else was worried that Draymond might kick Dwight in the nuts when they fell down and got tangled up?
One thing unfolding before our eyes is draymond destroying warriors culture. He is a bad leader for these young lads. How can u tell quese not to push Doncic when all draymond does is cuss the referees. I feel he is overrated and honestly doesn't contribute much to scoring and mostly gets hockey assists. He has single Handedly harmed this team more any other player. I don't know the leverage his defense gives that they can't flip him. We always talked about Andrew's defense till he got to Miami and is now getting exposed on nightly basis. Most of those guys just benefitted from being around the 3 best shot makers in the league..Draymond will end up in China within 2 yrs if the warriors trade him. Yet he behaves like he is the reason the team is in existence. Dude is making 38% FG and 26% 3pt yet all he does is go to Vegas for some fight or go to the Grammy. I seriously question his commitment. We all saw how impotenten our attack was after klay went down because nobody could make shots..nobody guards draymond at the 3pt line yet he never feels motivated to improve, all he brags about is some championship that he happened to have been carried to
Okay, we get it, you love KD and don't understand basketball. Cool story, bro. Chill.
Slim, man I am sorry but I have to disagree with most everything you said.
I am not sure where you get hockey assists from a guy averaging 7 assists per game the last 5 years. If you don't see how he impacts the game you are not looking close enough- or you don't watch the playoffs. I would say Draymond ending up in China is the most preposterous of your statements, but then you questioned the guys commitment. That's ridiculous man. The guy puts everything he can into his game with the tools he has as an undersized big who not only runs the offense but also the defense. When they say the guy has a genius mind for basketball it is because of how he thinks about the game. To understand Draymond's impact takes a little effort if you are not used to recognizing it.
C'mon man... you can't get mad at Dray in a tank season. 3 championships, 5 straight finals in the last 5 seasons. Going in to this game without Wigs and Steph - there was zero chance it would even be close. It's a good game to evaluate the youngsters, and to see what the big Dragon Bender can do. (so far, he's not doing much... but he's got an interesting, Joe Harris-type of catch and shoot 3pt game that I'd like to see more )
I'm extremely intrigued by Bender. He's wily, seems to always be in a good spot.
Do u even watch the GAMES? IN WHAT alternate reality is bender a good basketballer?
Unfortunately, I watch every single game :(
Maybe u watch the GAMES with the TV upside down or you have zero idea that a 7ft centre has more responsibility than just shooting 3s..
Hey people, be respectful in the comments. We can be passionate without insulting each other.
Bender has not been a good basketball player so far. But he's only 22. He can shoot 3s, and he's 7 ft 1. He's got tools to become a good basketball player. That's the luxury of having no-bearing games in a tank season. Kerr and Bob can bring in some projects to evaluate and see if they can contribute next season.
IF Bender can play better defense and pass, he could play that high-post on offense and facilitate. That's what these tank games are good for.
You're the same guy strongly advocating for dumping NBA champ, and former defensive player of the year, Draymond Green for Aaron Gordon, whose biggest claim to fame is being awesome in the dunk contest?
Just because Dray is emotional, and pouty sometimes doesn't take anything away from how critical he's been for this franchise. It's weird to me that "defense is half the game" is such a famous saying, and yet so many people are more than happy to completely ignore it (probably because offensive numbers are so much easier to convert into counting stats).
I'm glad you said former DPOY. The fact that he on it then doesn't mean his impact hasn't atrociously reduced that they can't move on from him. Hope you know his inability to shoot at a high clip creates spacing problems. Aaron Gordon may only be know for his dunking but u won't fail to admit that he is a better scorer than draymond. You also can't just back off him at the 3pt line. Its also a known fact that one of the most unfortunate things in basketball is to try to defend curry one on one. Having a PF like AG creates more of those one on one scenarios. Also iOS the defensive impact of draymond huge enough to mitigate his inability to score.? For all I know Rudy Gobert is a 2x Dpoy yet he averages more points every year than draymond at a higher efficiency. In the end he that scores the most points get to win the game.Having someone like draymond wh doesnt score put enormous pressure on the splash brothers to score. Andre used to make few defensive stop and end up with +20 on the box score. Now in Miami how come he still makes those few defensive stops and end up being the outlier with -33 on the box SCORE?
Steph hasn't won MVP for years. He's only shooting 24% from deep this season. You done with him too?
My core point here is that sample size matters, and the importance of the game matters.
We do not have Dray on this team to score points, and the VAST majority of his career here has been excellent. I respect your right to have your own opinion, but I'm not swayed just yet that Draymond is any sort of anchor that's holding the franchise down.
There is. You don't quit on your team. What precedence is he laying for the young players. Steph and klay never quit on their team members even though they did the heavy lifting. That's why we were able to comeback and win playoff series against OKC and Houston... Even Steve kerr mentioned that the team needed him so badly yesterday. Draymond is full of antics. People said he was more important than klay. I personally believe we need a taller PF that can playmake,shoot and score like Aaron Gordon to replace draymond. We can't win championships anymore with draymond unless he relearn how to shoot. Defenders are backing off him and doubling curry. He doesn't help spacing at all..
Wow. Not even any credit for Draymond during the championship years? His defensive chops allowed the team to run a small ball unit and popularized the switching defense. His vision and ball-handling solved the Curry trap allowing for easy buckets in a 4-on-3 situation. Duby Dub Dubs tweeted out a stat recently that Draymond average assists per 100 hasn't dipped much even when surrounded by below average perimeter shooters. If Draymond could shoot, he would be the best player in the league.
Which vision. Didn't Andre and Shawn run those 4 on 3 mismatches too?Give the ball to Aaron Gordon in those 4 on 3 situations and let's see if he wouldn't run it. Also people forget the effect of his salary on the cap space. You really want to give 25mullion of cap per year to a player who averages a triple single? Tell me the last time draymond has locked down a perimeter threat. It was klay and Andre locking down harden, Westbrook and kwahi while draymond would hide behind and bark orders like a drill sergeant.. I thought great defensive players used to relish taking the toughest defensive assignments?. It was klay and Andre doing that..
lol. It's a troll! You've arrived guys!
I know. I am so proud of LGW right now.
It's just loaded questions one after the other.
I definitely agree that Draymond needs to be a 3pt threat. He needs to be at least a 35% 3pt shooter that teams cannot just leave open on purpose. That wide-open 3pt set shot of 35% accuracy is the most easily achievable goal for him because all he needs to do is shoot 200 3s in practice every day. No reason why he can't achieve this especially since he has done it before.
Aaron Gordon would be nice, but let's be honest. Gordon hasn't proven anything. He hasn't won a playoff series yet. Do we know AG can guard the likes of Anthony Davis and switch to the likes of Lebron or Westbrook? During those playoff victories against the Rockets, Draymond was guarding both Clint Capela AND helping on the guard penetration. Draymond has that pitbull a-hole personality that you need to win big playoff games. Maybe Gordon has it, buy maybe he doesn't. I like AG by the way. That off-the-side-backboard alleyoop twisting one-hand scoop dunk defies physics.
All the respect to Draymond for what he's done for the Warriors over the years... That being said, I do think that he, the Warriors organization and the fanbase should himself/him to a higher standard though - to lead the league in techs (14 along with Westbrook) given how many games he's missed and given the fat contract he just signed should not be acceptable, tank year or not.
And where's the Draymond who said the stuff below back in November:
"I'm going back to the way I was pre-KD, and that's exciting to me. I had to give up shots to make sure Kevin [Durant] gets his touches, and I don't regret that. It got me a couple of championships. But as a competitor, as someone who's still in his prime, who's been in the gym all summer trying to improve my game, it's exciting to know that I can go back to playing the way that I was playing before.
You haven't seen the best of me. I'm definitely not at my peak. I have so much room to grow, new heights that I can reach -- like becoming a 40% 3-point shooter. That'd be amazing, right? My shooting dropped off the last couple of seasons, but it's tough when you're taking only two or three 3s a game. My percentages were a lot higher when I took more."
https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/28078145/warriors-draymond-green-let-flamin-hot-cheetos-cool-down
Don't you know that he is just lying to everyone. He has no offensive game without curry. After saying that he gave up shots to KD, now with plethora of shots to go around he is shooting a whooping 26% 3pt and 38% FG. Mind you his FG% was 45 % in the season he said he gave up shots to KD..Now his new lie is that he isn't taking this season seriously and he is preparing for next season..Even the bulls had to reload after the first 3peat.Draymond is just tricking everyone. I hope the warriors F.O will open their eyes and see.there is a serious spacing issue on that team with his lack of shooting.
Sorry, we can't share pics in chat comments (yet!) here, but this comment made me do a little leg work to try and understand Dray's shooting over the course of his career.
I'll put this in the next preview (tomorrow) but take a look at the shape of his 3pt% in the graphic
https://twitter.com/Punk_Basketball/status/1233471220622020609
and let's have a real talk about a realistic target for Green's outside shot. I'm not sure what "getting his shot back" looks like at this point, but getting back above 35% would be a major victory imo
To stir the pot, I believe that highest bump in Dray 3P% was under coach Luke Walton
Even more stirred:
Oddly enough, in that 2015-16 season, Dray’s 3-pt percentages were highest with Luke Walton at the helm.
With Luke Walton: 41.4% 3P
With Steve Kerr: 34.9% 3P
♡ He averaged nearly a triple-double in the playoffs last year (13.3/10.1/8.5.) Short memories around here.
Draymond in the elimination game in the Finals against the Raptors: 19 points, 13 assists, 11 rebounds.
It was in one series against Portland. Post what he averaged in the finals and post what siakam the guy he was supposed to be guarding AVERAGED?
Um, Draymond averaged 14.8/11.0/9.3 in the Finals. You may want to do a little research before posting I'll let you do your own further research. 😎
Read the comment above this one. Check out his performance in game 7 of the 2015/16 finals- 32 points on 15FGA, 15 rebounds, 9 assists & 2 steals- or really just look at his playoff performances. Dray is a winner. It's strange that a dubs fan would be so hostile to him, but then again, maybe you aren't that
One game 4 yrs ago. I'm sure if Michel Jordan based his career on the 1993 nba finals and didn't remind people what he could do going foward it would be easy to call him the GOAT. Tell me what curry averaged in each finals and how his ppg increased in each final..draymond should easily be able to to this especially since nobody guards him..also tell me another time he has had this type of game in the last 3yrs..
In the previous two comments you've handwaved away a sterling performance in a finals game 7 and last year's entire (undermanned) Western Conference Finals series. You're not making a real effort to sound serious here.
I think congrats is in order LGW staff. Is this our first troll?
Draymond will be in the HOF. But carry on with your narrative...
Man, it just sounds like you haven't watched the playoff games. Draymond has dominated so many tough matchups over the years in those games, including the truly bizarre mismatch of AD in 2018.
Looks like I picked the right half to sorta watch. Sounds like the entire 2nd half of this game was just the Warriors getting worked over.
Also, I'm curious to know the quarter by quarter breakdown on this
> "The Warriors are ranked 28th in the NBA in third quarter plus/minus at a withering -2.4"
The team is a net -9.6 per game, which oddly enough is about -2.4 points per quarter
Yeah, I don't think the team is much worse in any particular quarter this year. They're very versatile in which quarter happens to be the one that makes you want to gouge out your eyeballs.
It sucks, but I can't believe anyone is counting. This whole season has been about trying to find guys to turn into future resources -- either coming off the bench or tradeable for draft picks. It's been a mess. But player development has gone mostly well, except perhaps in the case of DeAngelo Russell; he grew a bit but not nearly enough and ended up getting traded.
When Steph returns, it'll be about seeing how he, Wiggins, and Dray blend. We'll also get to see how the younger guys fare with Steph's gravity changing the spacing on the court. Not quite a championship run, but you take what you can get...
I feel like this is the worst warrior's team I've seen since the Troy-Murhpy-as-a-primary-option days
Even deeper, this is probably the worst Warriors roster I can remember - ok, maybe some of those mid 80's teams, but I was young enough to not properly appreciate how bad my local bad basketball team was
I would rank the '99 team with the big free agent signing of Mookie Blaylock high up there as one of the worst teams I've seen. The most memorable moment was old man Terry Cummings hitting a corner three. He finished the season shooting 100% from three.
Eight losses in a row. Feels like more.