SoL, it’s just regular old team stats — points scored and allowed per 100 possessions. You’re not obligated to credit Hollinger, a bit of charlatan who devised the ridiculous “PER” stat, and now occasionally drops brilliant takes like (most recently) the 76ers should be the 2023 Finals favorites.
My experience with playing sports ( God, it seems so long ago, can’t believe we wore leather helmets) was that I almost always played better when we were winning even if not as many minutes. A great example of that, for me, is the beginning of last season when we were on a tear and JTA starting looking like a beast in limited minutes. Once we hit a rough patch his play seemed to drop off in lockstep with our losses. That’s why I think it would be wise for Kerr & Co to focus on winning instead of worrying about sunk costs and the puzzle pieces might just fall into place.
I’m glad i can read comments here without listening to hate filled screeds or takes that dont remember this is supposed to fun even when it’s a dissapointing mess. The world is too fucked up, so I like that I can come here and laugh, learn, and still smile when the dynasty falters.
There's an argument to be made here that the offseason mistakes the FO made were letting DLee and JTA go. Both of them knew the system well enough to help integrate OPJ, Bjeli, and GP2 well last year. This year, they let go of everyone who knew the system except for JP3. Perhaps they thought MM and JK picked up more of the system their first year than they actually did (and MM's 2-man ratings back this up), or perhaps they just were too confident in the starters. But it's quite apparent that the utter lack of system knowledge by anyone on the bench is really fucking shit up. If instead of JMG, they had kept JTA, would they be better off right now? If DLee was playing instead of DDV or even TW (requiring the 15th spot), would they be better off right now?
I think it could be argued that the answer to both is Yes.
No. You do realize there is but a finite number of roster spots and we drafted three players this offseason. U keep jta or lee and youre either not signing iguodala ddv or jmg. Granted jmg looks a bit washed on defense right now but i dont think jta wins us any of those games weve lost.
I get it on the surface there's no way you say that JTA > JMG, but JTA's contribution to defense, passion, focus, and his on-court tutelage of the kids and newcomers is not to be dismissed lightly. One of the big reasons the integration of GP2, OPJ, and Bjeli went so well is from the fact that JTA and DLee both knew the system and were able to help direct and teach. Certainly, by the end of the season, talent won out, and JTA was out of the rotation, but both JTA and DLee both contributed a lot to the early season run and from an on-court teaching perspective.
We used to complain about JTA and Lee getting run over Moody and Kuminga. Maybe not you specifically but all of last year i can attest personally that here and on Twitter both JTA and Lee (except Beli) were excoriated for taking time away from the youngens. Now me personally i wanted bjelica gone gone and at one point i wanted Moses Brown insteD. Point is now im seeing some serious revisionist history occur in regards to these 3 players as we struggle.
Raises hand 🙋♀️ me. I said last year’s roster was an A+ that would turn into a B if Wiseman came back. Do we have to tank this whole year playing Wiseman for me to get any props?
Wiseman has averaged 13.5 minutes per game this season. No, he's not magically developing into what we dream he might be one day fast enough. But he's not to blame for the string of road losses.
I'm surprised kerr isnt getting more flack for this year. The lineups he has been playing have proven over the years not to work. The drop coverage with wiseman has been something alot of us have disagreed with for 2 years and it seems it's being forced onto the team.
Alot of ua have also wanted to let wiseman spot up and show his jumper every now and then, this would help spacing so much.
Kerr has also refused to play kuminga which is just ridiculous imo. You cant say it's because of his play because we are 3-6 without him and you cant say it's his attitude because how do you bench a 20 year old for attitude but have 32 year old man in the starting lineup who just punched poole
I didn't want to have Wiseman shoot 3Ps this season. He loves them but I'm not sure it's really a weapon. His underlying FT% doesn't support it and his 3P% didn't really support it either. A lot of the thought process was play like McGee on offense and then add in the jumper. One less thing for him to worry about. And for all his flaws, he has a > .600 TS%. Add in a below average 3P that he's not good at? Might be even more disastrous.
I know you're a big believer in Kuminga, but he and Draymond don't operate under the same rules in terms of expectations, attitude benching, etc. One of them has hung four banners for the team.
(And this is coming from someone who was pretty sick of Draymond in the aftermath of the punch.)
You can criticize kerr without being labeled someone who wants him fired. This issue with tinkering is he tinkered with lineups for the last 2 years we already know what works and what doesnt, curry is the only player that can sustain multiple non offensive threats on the court. Poole will play much better with jmg at the 5 spacing the floor and kuminga at the 4 and a pnr partner
Kuminga and wiseman could possibly play together if they let wiseman spot up and see how he does, jmg still spaces the floor because he’s atleast a threat, they’re not going to Westbrook him
whole bench (with partial exception of Moody) has struggled (to put it mildly lol), but the biggest issue I see here is Poole: just got the bag & he doesn't have a single positive pairing on the team right now
the team can adjust around Wiseman's struggles much more easily than around Poole falling from Sixth Man of the Year candidate to how he's playing now
The "Poole and Klay can't play together" conclusion doesn't make much sense to me. We saw the Curry/Poole/Klay/Wiggins/Looney lineup have a +48.8 net rating in 44 minutes last season, for instance.
What would be the basketball argument for why they theoretically can't play together?
I guess maybe a more coherent basketball argument might be:
they roasted the Nuggets who had at most one good guard on either end, but now other teams are more prepared, and most have more weapons to contain the Splash offense & punish them on the other end
> most have more weapons to contain the Splash offense
Teams are adjusting to Curry/Klay/Poole by having more weapons on the floor? Is that really a strategy though?
> punish them on the other end
I think Klay has looked much better defensively this season, so I don't really buy that these guys could absolutely roast the Milwaukee Bucks at home last season (which was not the nickname lineup, to be clear, but was Looney in there instead of Draymond) but now are incapable of playing against the Hornets together.
Imo it is more what DFIB said so far, Klay has been working his way into shape and Poole is in a cold stretch.
no, I'm saying most teams have more backcourt weapons than the 2021-2022 Nuggets, which is where we saw the breakout of the Splash Party (I am committed to making this name happen) lineup
good point tho that we saw the Looney-for-Dray version of the three guard lineup thrive earlier in the season
Didn't see this second comment. Could be. I think the current version of Poole is harder to play with. He has "regressed" in the sense that he has looked way less decisive, he's doing that shit where he makes 3 dribble moves instead of 1 again. Right now I am chalking it up to a confidence issue that I am chalking up to being thrust into a much harder role as the leader of the bench. I think the proper version of Poole and Klay will work well together, personally. I have only gotten more confident about that this season after seeing how well Klay is moving defensively.
Willing to reassess if these early patterns hold though.
We had a hell of a 2021-2022 season that was capped with a RING. This was partly due to the awesome supporting players that we had. Yet, we let go four of them and one left voluntarily. I know the plan is to develop young players but I sometimes scratch my head on why a team who played so well together and won a championship doesn’t keep those key supporting players. Wouldn’t you want to keep a winning team together? Just letting off some steam.
My feeling, at this point, is you either run it back hard or build for the future. Start moving pieces further and further to the back of the bench until they fall off as new pieces are needed to keep the run going. JMG and JW for GP2. Interested, Dame?
Yep, nowhere near panic yet. We have some real talent on that bench, though less experience this year. Time will cure ALL; got to figure out their roles/combinations first, then, build that familiarity/chemistry into winning, 2-way ball. No doubt, Kerr/staff/team will get there for another Ship run. 66 pts from Splash Bros was a real positive to take away. So, let the young uns get their run and figure it out tonight, and remember the 0-6 road start of this season...
Back-to-backs are always tough for our coverage here. Trying out something between a game thread and preview. Please let me know any feedback you may have: https://dubnationhq.com/p/just-forget-it-kerr-resting-everyone
(as usual these days, that's going to be the game thread)
According to Hollinger's NBA Team Stats, Warriors are #13 in offense and #22 in defense.
SoL, it’s just regular old team stats — points scored and allowed per 100 possessions. You’re not obligated to credit Hollinger, a bit of charlatan who devised the ridiculous “PER” stat, and now occasionally drops brilliant takes like (most recently) the 76ers should be the 2023 Finals favorites.
So I should use the nba.com stats instead? In that case, the Warriors are #13 in offense and #26 in defense.
And apparently, the Lakers are #30 in offense and #2 in defense, and Clippers are #29 in offense and #4 in defense using the nba.com stats.
Headline/ KoolAid signs Ye and Kyrie to multimillion $ endorsement contracts…….for same flavor, of course!
Tropical Nut?
As in jonestown koolaide?
as in believing in a dangerous idea in hopes reward
My experience with playing sports ( God, it seems so long ago, can’t believe we wore leather helmets) was that I almost always played better when we were winning even if not as many minutes. A great example of that, for me, is the beginning of last season when we were on a tear and JTA starting looking like a beast in limited minutes. Once we hit a rough patch his play seemed to drop off in lockstep with our losses. That’s why I think it would be wise for Kerr & Co to focus on winning instead of worrying about sunk costs and the puzzle pieces might just fall into place.
I’m glad i can read comments here without listening to hate filled screeds or takes that dont remember this is supposed to fun even when it’s a dissapointing mess. The world is too fucked up, so I like that I can come here and laugh, learn, and still smile when the dynasty falters.
End love letter to dnhq
Amen, brother, amen.
You know what? I've reconsidered my stance after considering the points made in this video, I think last night was actually a productive game:
https://twitter.com/defaut_zero/status/1588637648096493570
Oh the delicious never-gonna-happen irony of Wise being tank commander for the guy who would replace him.
There's an argument to be made here that the offseason mistakes the FO made were letting DLee and JTA go. Both of them knew the system well enough to help integrate OPJ, Bjeli, and GP2 well last year. This year, they let go of everyone who knew the system except for JP3. Perhaps they thought MM and JK picked up more of the system their first year than they actually did (and MM's 2-man ratings back this up), or perhaps they just were too confident in the starters. But it's quite apparent that the utter lack of system knowledge by anyone on the bench is really fucking shit up. If instead of JMG, they had kept JTA, would they be better off right now? If DLee was playing instead of DDV or even TW (requiring the 15th spot), would they be better off right now?
I think it could be argued that the answer to both is Yes.
As much as I liked JTA, he looked hesitant on both offense and defense last season. Perhaps the Warriors could've kept Lee, but oh well.
Speaking of which, in the 7 games that Lee has played with the Suns, he is averaging 16.6 minutes, 4.9 points/game, 33.3% FG, and 36.8% threes.
No. You do realize there is but a finite number of roster spots and we drafted three players this offseason. U keep jta or lee and youre either not signing iguodala ddv or jmg. Granted jmg looks a bit washed on defense right now but i dont think jta wins us any of those games weve lost.
I get it on the surface there's no way you say that JTA > JMG, but JTA's contribution to defense, passion, focus, and his on-court tutelage of the kids and newcomers is not to be dismissed lightly. One of the big reasons the integration of GP2, OPJ, and Bjeli went so well is from the fact that JTA and DLee both knew the system and were able to help direct and teach. Certainly, by the end of the season, talent won out, and JTA was out of the rotation, but both JTA and DLee both contributed a lot to the early season run and from an on-court teaching perspective.
We used to complain about JTA and Lee getting run over Moody and Kuminga. Maybe not you specifically but all of last year i can attest personally that here and on Twitter both JTA and Lee (except Beli) were excoriated for taking time away from the youngens. Now me personally i wanted bjelica gone gone and at one point i wanted Moses Brown insteD. Point is now im seeing some serious revisionist history occur in regards to these 3 players as we struggle.
Raises hand 🙋♀️ me. I said last year’s roster was an A+ that would turn into a B if Wiseman came back. Do we have to tank this whole year playing Wiseman for me to get any props?
Wiseman has averaged 13.5 minutes per game this season. No, he's not magically developing into what we dream he might be one day fast enough. But he's not to blame for the string of road losses.
Yes, because he needs to pkay to get better, why would you think otherwise?
C.J. Holmes 🦹🏾♂️
@CjHolmes22
I asked Stephen Curry what it takes to respond to this kind of adversity. He said the keys are essentially staying positive and not pointing fingers.
That’s our job. 😉
I'm doing my part.
I'm surprised kerr isnt getting more flack for this year. The lineups he has been playing have proven over the years not to work. The drop coverage with wiseman has been something alot of us have disagreed with for 2 years and it seems it's being forced onto the team.
Alot of ua have also wanted to let wiseman spot up and show his jumper every now and then, this would help spacing so much.
Kerr has also refused to play kuminga which is just ridiculous imo. You cant say it's because of his play because we are 3-6 without him and you cant say it's his attitude because how do you bench a 20 year old for attitude but have 32 year old man in the starting lineup who just punched poole
In fairness, every lineup with Wiseman has been proven not to work and they weren’t able to resign Bjelica to take up those minutes.
I didn't want to have Wiseman shoot 3Ps this season. He loves them but I'm not sure it's really a weapon. His underlying FT% doesn't support it and his 3P% didn't really support it either. A lot of the thought process was play like McGee on offense and then add in the jumper. One less thing for him to worry about. And for all his flaws, he has a > .600 TS%. Add in a below average 3P that he's not good at? Might be even more disastrous.
His jumper from midrange looks good and I rather him be developed as a stretch big who can dunk then a post threat, might as well let him shoot
I know you're a big believer in Kuminga, but he and Draymond don't operate under the same rules in terms of expectations, attitude benching, etc. One of them has hung four banners for the team.
(And this is coming from someone who was pretty sick of Draymond in the aftermath of the punch.)
I understand that but still, it's not a good look if it's an attitude issue
You can criticize kerr without being labeled someone who wants him fired. This issue with tinkering is he tinkered with lineups for the last 2 years we already know what works and what doesnt, curry is the only player that can sustain multiple non offensive threats on the court. Poole will play much better with jmg at the 5 spacing the floor and kuminga at the 4 and a pnr partner
Kuminga and wiseman could possibly play together if they let wiseman spot up and see how he does, jmg still spaces the floor because he’s atleast a threat, they’re not going to Westbrook him
https://twitter.com/anthonyVslater/status/1588585826744606720?t=xTw93Tlqf7QtKAl1TlqsIQ&s=19
No Curry, Klay, Dray, or Wiggins tonight.
Maybe they can pull off something like the game @SAS last year.
Um. Wow. So, will this be interesting or unwatchable? I'm afraid. But I will watch.
I'm just hoping for a < 35 point loss, personally. I don't think I'm going to watch this one live. I might throw my TV out the window.
Kerr sure wasn’t joking when he said he would change the rotations.
Warriors 2-man net ratings: https://twitter.com/Baltej_hoops/status/1588569224733429760?s=20&t=dfFguTVibXp8S-gTr4m_oA
whole bench (with partial exception of Moody) has struggled (to put it mildly lol), but the biggest issue I see here is Poole: just got the bag & he doesn't have a single positive pairing on the team right now
the team can adjust around Wiseman's struggles much more easily than around Poole falling from Sixth Man of the Year candidate to how he's playing now
even in minutes without Wiseman, Poole is -9.8: https://twitter.com/ThePackageJG/status/1588522525390426113?s=20&t=dfFguTVibXp8S-gTr4m_oA
and three guard lineups w/ Poole, Steph, and Klay… a catastrophic -26: https://twitter.com/fakelogic/status/1588533269838311425/photo/1
The "Poole and Klay can't play together" conclusion doesn't make much sense to me. We saw the Curry/Poole/Klay/Wiggins/Looney lineup have a +48.8 net rating in 44 minutes last season, for instance.
What would be the basketball argument for why they theoretically can't play together?
I guess maybe a more coherent basketball argument might be:
they roasted the Nuggets who had at most one good guard on either end, but now other teams are more prepared, and most have more weapons to contain the Splash offense & punish them on the other end
> most have more weapons to contain the Splash offense
Teams are adjusting to Curry/Klay/Poole by having more weapons on the floor? Is that really a strategy though?
> punish them on the other end
I think Klay has looked much better defensively this season, so I don't really buy that these guys could absolutely roast the Milwaukee Bucks at home last season (which was not the nickname lineup, to be clear, but was Looney in there instead of Draymond) but now are incapable of playing against the Hornets together.
Imo it is more what DFIB said so far, Klay has been working his way into shape and Poole is in a cold stretch.
no, I'm saying most teams have more backcourt weapons than the 2021-2022 Nuggets, which is where we saw the breakout of the Splash Party (I am committed to making this name happen) lineup
good point tho that we saw the Looney-for-Dray version of the three guard lineup thrive earlier in the season
Splash Party? Based on this year's performance, more like Trash Party! Zing! ok... I'mma go back to the shadows.
basketball argument? idk (something something Klay thrives in movement systems something Poole likes to dribble around a lot?)
maybe they have beef that's preventing them from meshing well?
Didn't see this second comment. Could be. I think the current version of Poole is harder to play with. He has "regressed" in the sense that he has looked way less decisive, he's doing that shit where he makes 3 dribble moves instead of 1 again. Right now I am chalking it up to a confidence issue that I am chalking up to being thrust into a much harder role as the leader of the bench. I think the proper version of Poole and Klay will work well together, personally. I have only gotten more confident about that this season after seeing how well Klay is moving defensively.
Willing to reassess if these early patterns hold though.
Klay's not fully in game shape, and none of them have really recovered from their championship hangover?
We had a hell of a 2021-2022 season that was capped with a RING. This was partly due to the awesome supporting players that we had. Yet, we let go four of them and one left voluntarily. I know the plan is to develop young players but I sometimes scratch my head on why a team who played so well together and won a championship doesn’t keep those key supporting players. Wouldn’t you want to keep a winning team together? Just letting off some steam.
Especially when they could have retained 3 of them for the cost of one losing player that hasn’t earned playing time but gets it anyway.
Kuminga has to be watching JW’s play from his perch in the 2nd bench row and thinking “What the holy hell.”
My feeling, at this point, is you either run it back hard or build for the future. Start moving pieces further and further to the back of the bench until they fall off as new pieces are needed to keep the run going. JMG and JW for GP2. Interested, Dame?
Also, who says you can’t concentrate on winning and build your rotations out after the All Star break.
GP2 still injured, I believe.
Injured still a better +/-
bwahahahahahahaha.
Man, that is some dark shit.
🧐
So the Warriors are 3-1 at home. Now they just need to convince the NBA to let them play all their games at Chase...
Yep, nowhere near panic yet. We have some real talent on that bench, though less experience this year. Time will cure ALL; got to figure out their roles/combinations first, then, build that familiarity/chemistry into winning, 2-way ball. No doubt, Kerr/staff/team will get there for another Ship run. 66 pts from Splash Bros was a real positive to take away. So, let the young uns get their run and figure it out tonight, and remember the 0-6 road start of this season...