Howard 17.8 pts on 602 TS / 13.3 reb / +3.9 net on-off
Favors 15.7 pts on .566 TS / 10.5 reb / -0.5 net on-off
Guessing they think the big gap in production/ efficiency outweighs the 37 v. 32 age gap.
But do we know how serious they are about Howard? Could just be kicking the tires. I can't say I'd be *thrilled* about adding him, but if Steph, Dray, and Kerr supported it (which I assume would be prerequisites) so would I.
That was a situation where (reportedly) the vet players wanted someone and the FO wanted someone else. I'm talking about a situation where the FO wants someone and the vet players and coach approve of him.
Also, Avery Bradley that offseason was a pretty bad basketball player who did nothing particularly well, whereas I think Dwight even at 37 still does a couple things pretty well (rebound, defend the post, score efficiently on low volume, e.g.)
I think the point is, Steph, Klay, and Dray do not have the best record when it comes to figuring out who would be useful role player contributors. The AB over GPII is a pretty high-profile miss, and it may have been because they liked an age peer better, which clouded their basketball judgment. If so, as they age, that problem may escalate. And picking 37 over 32 resembles a similar fiasco in the making. (This isn't for Sleepy, who has blocked me, it is for people who want to think about basketball, talent evaluation, and whether players tend to be good at it or not given that they can't put in the time other staff can).
Tom's family had fled the Russian revolution in 1917 and moved to China, where Tom was born as Tomislav Nikolayevich Meshcheryakov (Томислав Николаевич Мещеряков). During WWII they were moved to an internment camp near Tokyo for 4 years, and they emigrated to San Francisco after the war. His father changed the family name to Meschery during the red scare in the fifties.
Tom played at Lowell High, a regional powerhouse at the time, and then at St. Mary's, helping them get to the elite 8. He was drafted by Philadelphia as the #7 pick, and they moved the team to San Francisco after his rookie season so he got to come back home. He made the all-star game in 1963, and was the first foreign born player to do so. He helped the Warriors reach the finals in 1967, but then was picked by the SuperSonics in the expansion draft. Tom finished his career after 4 years in Seattle.
Here is some footage of that finals match-up, with Tom and a young Rick Barry taking on Wilt in the first finals with the Celtics in 11 years: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ldoBfVUW6Wc At least, I think Tom is in there, not the highest resolution.
Nicknamed "The Mad Russian", Tom was another one of those tough dudes on the court. Here is his wife talking about how she was not aware of his on-court personality: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-4x5rmoBcuw
After hanging up his high-tops, Tom took up poetry, and has been writing poetry and novels since. He was inducted into the Nevada Writers Hall of Fame in 2002, which is a pretty cool second career, and makes more sense for a basketball player when you find that he is related to Tolstoy. He also taught high school English in Reno for a few decades.
"I loved Curry—who doesn't?—and I really started identifying with Draymond Green," says Meschery. "We were both undersized players who were asked to do so much more than a normal power forward. I had to score as well as pound the boards. Now, overall, obviously, Draymond is a lot more talented than I was and certainly a far, far better ballhandler. But I see a lot of myself in him."
and also:
“There’s lots of people in the Bay Area who look at my banner and say, ‘Who’s that guy?’” says Meschery. “I understand that. In terms of production, I’m not Rick Barry or Wilt Chamberlain or Chris Mullin.
“But I’m homegrown, a child of San Francisco. I was on the first team that came here from Philadelphia. I feel a very strong connection to the Warriors. So while I’m not the Best Warrior or the Immortal Warrior or anything like that, I like to think of myself as the First Warrior. And that makes me very, very proud.”
Thanks all for your encouragement - I'm enjoying researching the players I know almost nothing about and the ones I thought I knew all about. And, it helps me pass the time since I'm not watching games a few hours a night.
Another prime example of the communal creative chops we keep coming back to at DNHQ. Now if you could only do a League wide jersey countup for each Dubs win when we start the regular season...
Probably won't have to worry about who wore #73, but you got me wondering what is the lowest number that has never been worn by an NBA player? Are they any or has every number been covered?
So, after a bit of clicking at basketball-reference.com, I'm pretty sure the following numbers have not been worn in the NBA:
58, 64, 68, 69, 74, 75, 78, 79, 80, 82, 87
Will the Dubs get to 58 wins this year? They got 67, 58, and 57 during the Durant years, and got 67 and 73 earlier in the dynasty, but it seems pretty unlikely. Unless they are getting 2010 CP3 and DH somehow.
I did not know who Tom Meschery was until now. The SI article on him is excellent reading. I love the contrast between the ‘ Mad Dog’ tough player and the poet and writer. Thanks for introducing me to this interesting person.
Lakers lose in 7 to the Boston Celtics in tonight’s episode of Winning Time
EDIT- Also it looks like thats it for Winning Time. they added a small snippet at the very end between Jeannie and Jerry then they summarized the rest of the Lakers history during final credits. I guess they got word the ghouls running HBO weren’t going to renew. Its ok though i just cancelled my Max subscription. Im only gonna miss the last season of Doom Patrol. They can shove their reality tv crap down their ******
Breaking: #WinningTime Cancelled After 2 Seasons at HBO
EDIT 3
We’ll probably not see a show of that scope and magnitude for a long while. Yeah you've got ur epic shows like Game of Thrones but a show that focuses on a singular genre like this with this type of casting
I'm downloading it as I write this. They must have come under a lot of pressure to pull the plug on one of the great farces to have ever been aired. They say America is the home of the free and brave. Never has there been more of break between the masses and their keepers on almost every level. Anyone enjoying a good comedy should watch this series.
I did — the first few episodes, anyway. Thought it was pretty well done — not engaging enough to keep me watching the full season, apparently, but pretty amusing for what it was.
But of course, how much I liked it is not really relevant to my comment. I’m just noting the fact that it was cancelled for lack of viewers relative to the cost of making the show — not for any other nefarious reason.
Only Latrell Sprewell (#15) days left until training camp, and we are halfway through the final month of the off-season.
Another one of those "what could have been" players, and one of those "why do these bad things always happen to the Warriors" events. For so many years it seemed like it was just one thing after another.
In retrospect, with our better understanding of mental health issues, I feel sorry for him that he didn't have better support for working things out. But, it is always a balance, on the one hand, yes, clearly he had problems to have just snapped like that, but at the same time, he is responsible for his actions, and I'm never in support of violence for trying to solve a problem.
A result is, his ESPN biography mostly focuses on him assaulting a coach, rather than what he did on the court:
Interesting comparison. Choke a coach at practice, Commissioner suspends the player 82 games. Punch a teammate in the face (risking concussion or even murder), and a substantial bit of the vibe is when is that so-called "victim" gonna get the hell over it and play like he cares about the team?
It's stuff like this-a major punishment for assaulting management during practice, and "its an internal matter" for assaulting a worker during practice--that makes the NBA, for all its progressive posturing, continue to resemble a southern plantation or an exploitive sweat shop to some people.
Anyway, it makes me happy that Spree found a home with the Knicks later on. PJ Carlesimo was notoriously a brutal coach, apparently borderline verbally abusive. I doubt Sprewell was the only player to want to choke the living sh*t out of him, he unfortunately was the only one to put thought into action.
One of my favorite warriors. I considered making my handle a spre reference!
There are so many times I wanted to choke and punch my highschool soccer coach, and probably would have had i not been a fairly timid child…. Maybe thats why at the time i completely blamed Carlisle :)
Found this firsthand comment, which sounds encouraging:
@familygonzcartwright801 1 day ago
Alchemy, I'm from Spain, I've seen Garuba play in every game with the national team and every single game I thought, this guy is Draymond from Spain. Obviously, he is not there yet, but the main reason why he didn't play in Houston is precisely the way Houston was built, a player built for team play didn't fit in that Houston squad that was all young players trying to score.
Excited for Garuba! Exactly the kind of player we should have used the second 2-way on. I think he has a fair shot to be utilized better with GSW than the Rockets.
Lots of fans feeling like this off-season is going on forever, and we can't wait to see how the new Warriors TJD, Podz, and Usman will fit in, well, them and CP3, Dario, and Cory too, and maybe even Dwight Howard???
Well, hang in there, it's only Al Attles (#16) days until training camp. First it was back-to-back Brazilians, now it is back-to-back retired jerseys.
Al's nickname was "The Destroyer", and he was a menace on defense. He played for the Warriors for 11 years, coached for 13 years, and has stayed with the organization from 1960 until today. That's like, exactly my entire life, and I'm not young.
Somewhat unfortunately, probably his most famous highlight was an on-court altercation, but even that shows something about his personality. This was in game 4 of the 1975 finals, with the Warriors, coached by Al, up 3 - 0 on the Washington Bullets. Mike Riordan decided to jump Rick Barry, who was known to have a bit of a temper himself, and Al flew off the bench and got in the middle of it, probably to save Rick from retaliating and getting tossed. In the end, Al did get kicked out of the game, but in those days, this was not for coming off the bench and joining a fracas, but for continuing to argue with the ref. The Dubs managed to win that game without him on the sidelines, sweeping the Bullets for what was their last NBA championship for quite a few years.
Playing for Attles meant that everybody was involved; he frequently used rotations of 10-11 players, most of whom reached double-figures in minutes played. Warriors legend Rick Barry, who played both with and under Attles, put it this way: “We were a team of the highest order.”
“Everyone on that team knew that his time would come,” said Barry. “If you weren’t cutting it, someone else would get a shot. Al didn’t care who it was — and I should know.” In Game 7 of the 1975 Western Conference Finals against the Chicago Bulls, Barry, who had averaged over 30 points per game in the regular season, was benched by Attles after a cold shooting performance in the first half.
Barry continued: “Think about that. How many coaches would take their top player out of a game that important? But the guys picked me up.” That was The Al Attles Method.
And finally, for all of us JTA fans, we can also thank Al indirectly for Juan's love of basketball. In case you hadn't heard the story, Juan's third grade teacher was none other than Wilhelmina Attles, Al's wife, and she helped Juan attend a Warriors camp that really started his basketball career.
Attles also holds an NBA record for combined points by teammates in one game (117). Of course, Wilt had 100 of those, but Attles was 8/8 from the field and hit his only FT for what we now call a Wiggins (17 points).
I was at that WCF Game 7 sitting in the rafters and witnessed an amazing comeback led by Phil Smith, Charles Dudley, and Derrick Dickey. The only reason I could get tickets was because Rick Barry had a brain fart on Game 5, causing the Dubs to lose and then have to fly to Chicago down 3-2. No one expected the Dubs to bounce back in Game 6 but they did so I called Ticketron on the phone to reserve tickets.
So two-ways are LQ and Garuba right? The Dubs still don't have a 14th, and the 15th will be vacant. When will we know whether the teams get two vs. three 2-way contracts to use?
For that 14th slot, either LQ or Garuba could get promoted, and then there's the laundry list of vets and youngsters that are in camp or doing tryouts for the Dubs.
Here’s CBS’ team evaluating Houston picking Our Guy Garuba two years ago. Avery Johnson compared him to Kenneth Faried and the other guy said he was the 3rd best defender in the draft (behind Mitchell and Mobley). https://youtu.be/wbGL--02kuQ?si=e8zQ3d8A0Iq62SUT
Faried seems like a terrible comp to me. iIRC, he was basically a true C in a 6-8 frame who had no discernible NBA skill other than rebounding and trying really hard. Garuba seems much closer to Dray$ than to Faried in typology and skillset (elite awareness and switchability on D; decent passing, handles, and 3 pt shooting on O) even if he never actually approaches Dray’s level.
Garuba is an interesting pick up. He’s seems like the player Kerr has been (semi-successfully) trying to get Kuminga to be the last couple of years, but 1/10 the price and bigger/stronger. Kuminga’s offense may be the upside that gets him paid, but Garuba’s defense seems pretty playable right now.
I'm also really enjoying Connecticut. The injury to Brionna Jones was a huge bummer, but it has sort of forced them into a play style that really feels like their destiny, with Alyssa Thomas as a point-center and shooters everywhere else. (Thomas, for those who haven't seen her, is one of the most unique players in the sport. Injuries to both shoulders have left her without a jump shot, but she's strong as hell, a great defender, and nearly led the league in assists. Not sure what the best NBA comp would be—maybe Draymond, maybe pre-meltdown Ben Simmons, but better than those guys relative to the league. She'll come in third in the MVP vote this year.)
Also sad the Mystics couldn't quite get healthy in time to gel this year. They'd be a fun potential spoiler at full health. Britney Sykes is my favorite player to watch in the W right now. A little like prime Iguodala, or Pippen.
I have always enjoyed watching Diana Taurasi play.
The Liberty have now morphed into a team who, when playing their basketball style, have been described as playing ‘beautiful basketball.’. They depend a lot on the three point shot, sharing the ball, and lots of assists. Beautiful basketball. Who does that remind you of? That’s why I like this team.
Yeah I wandered away from football for a couple of decades because violence and concussions but I’ve gotten interested a bit again and 9ers certainly seem legit
If nothing else, I’m pretty sure the arrival of Garuba means we’ll no longer be in the awkward position of wondering whether we should root for a credibly-accused rapist.
I haven't heard Lamb mentioned anywhere as a possible Dub for this season anyway. Of course we don't know what the FO and Kerr have discussed but if they were considering him, they've been quiet about it.
I mean, a rhetorical question usually has an obvious answer… but in context, this feels like an attempt to invalidate g8tgod’s comment and redirect the conversation back to a presumption of guilt because “probability”, which is a mob mentality our legal system is deliberately setup to counteract.
Picking and choosing where to apply “guilt by probability” is a verrrry slippery slope, my friend… i understand you’ve got good intentions here, but I shudder at a society that approaches these problems in such ways…
I already feel bad for the woman. I assumed we all did. I was just saying I felt for Lamb too. Once the allegation is made, he's already guilty as far as a lot of people are concerned.
Of course you can feel however you want. As she did not press charges we can not even fall back on the official outcome of a trial (though trials often seem to acquit rapists even when they committed the act).
But I don't understand your position. If he is a rapist, why do you feel bad for him? If she made it up, why do you feel bad for her?
My dude or dudette, I can’t find where g8tgod says that if the guy is an actual rapist, they feel bad for the guy. I read “He has no way to exonerate himself if he isn't guilty”, which is pretty clear to me.
Yeah, but I'm saying that's kind of backwards. I guess it's good that, at least on the surface, g8tgod, and others are not judging without proof, but you only feel bad for the guy if he's innocent. He's most likely guilty. In my opinion, stating that you feel bad for the guy is inferring that you think he's not guilty.
I'm saying that, most likely, a girl got raped, he did it and his only punishment is a bad reputation. Yeah, it's true that if he's innocent he doesn't really have any options and when the ratio of false reports of rape: real reports of rape gets closer to 1:1 than the current roughly 1:10 (and that's not including all the rapes that don't get reported!). I'll start to feel bad for the men.
(I suppose I should close with, I'm not trying to throw shade at g8tgod or others in this thread. empathy is a good thing. It's just that, in the case of rape, statistics say it is mostly misdirected. Based on current society, I wonder how long it would take, if the rape was established as fact before there would be some saying she asked for it?...)
Can someone explain to me why we’re bringing back Dwight Howard and not Derrick Favors?
They don’t want to do anyone any favors
Career per 36
Howard 17.8 pts on 602 TS / 13.3 reb / +3.9 net on-off
Favors 15.7 pts on .566 TS / 10.5 reb / -0.5 net on-off
Guessing they think the big gap in production/ efficiency outweighs the 37 v. 32 age gap.
But do we know how serious they are about Howard? Could just be kicking the tires. I can't say I'd be *thrilled* about adding him, but if Steph, Dray, and Kerr supported it (which I assume would be prerequisites) so would I.
But didn’t they also want that other guy instead of GP2?
That was a situation where (reportedly) the vet players wanted someone and the FO wanted someone else. I'm talking about a situation where the FO wants someone and the vet players and coach approve of him.
Also, Avery Bradley that offseason was a pretty bad basketball player who did nothing particularly well, whereas I think Dwight even at 37 still does a couple things pretty well (rebound, defend the post, score efficiently on low volume, e.g.)
I think the point is, Steph, Klay, and Dray do not have the best record when it comes to figuring out who would be useful role player contributors. The AB over GPII is a pretty high-profile miss, and it may have been because they liked an age peer better, which clouded their basketball judgment. If so, as they age, that problem may escalate. And picking 37 over 32 resembles a similar fiasco in the making. (This isn't for Sleepy, who has blocked me, it is for people who want to think about basketball, talent evaluation, and whether players tend to be good at it or not given that they can't put in the time other staff can).
Only Tom Meschery (#14) days left until training camp! Back to numbers up in the rafters, Tom's 14 was retired by the Warriors on October 13, 1967, and was featured as part of the team logo from 1971 until 1974 (https://www.toddradom.com/blog/2020/12/17/a-retired-number-tribute-like-no-other-golden-state-warriors).
Tom's family had fled the Russian revolution in 1917 and moved to China, where Tom was born as Tomislav Nikolayevich Meshcheryakov (Томислав Николаевич Мещеряков). During WWII they were moved to an internment camp near Tokyo for 4 years, and they emigrated to San Francisco after the war. His father changed the family name to Meschery during the red scare in the fifties.
Tom played at Lowell High, a regional powerhouse at the time, and then at St. Mary's, helping them get to the elite 8. He was drafted by Philadelphia as the #7 pick, and they moved the team to San Francisco after his rookie season so he got to come back home. He made the all-star game in 1963, and was the first foreign born player to do so. He helped the Warriors reach the finals in 1967, but then was picked by the SuperSonics in the expansion draft. Tom finished his career after 4 years in Seattle.
Here is some footage of that finals match-up, with Tom and a young Rick Barry taking on Wilt in the first finals with the Celtics in 11 years: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ldoBfVUW6Wc At least, I think Tom is in there, not the highest resolution.
Nicknamed "The Mad Russian", Tom was another one of those tough dudes on the court. Here is his wife talking about how she was not aware of his on-court personality: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-4x5rmoBcuw
After hanging up his high-tops, Tom took up poetry, and has been writing poetry and novels since. He was inducted into the Nevada Writers Hall of Fame in 2002, which is a pretty cool second career, and makes more sense for a basketball player when you find that he is related to Tolstoy. He also taught high school English in Reno for a few decades.
Here are a few interviews from a decade ago:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mmJzgkKRw-I
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NpnIWjVGP_M
And, some more grainy highlights:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ctTjx41uaBg
This SI article is long-ish, but I found it a good read for more background: https://www.si.com/nba/2017/06/15/tom-meschery-golden-state-warriors-championship
including this quote:
"I loved Curry—who doesn't?—and I really started identifying with Draymond Green," says Meschery. "We were both undersized players who were asked to do so much more than a normal power forward. I had to score as well as pound the boards. Now, overall, obviously, Draymond is a lot more talented than I was and certainly a far, far better ballhandler. But I see a lot of myself in him."
and also:
“There’s lots of people in the Bay Area who look at my banner and say, ‘Who’s that guy?’” says Meschery. “I understand that. In terms of production, I’m not Rick Barry or Wilt Chamberlain or Chris Mullin.
“But I’m homegrown, a child of San Francisco. I was on the first team that came here from Philadelphia. I feel a very strong connection to the Warriors. So while I’m not the Best Warrior or the Immortal Warrior or anything like that, I like to think of myself as the First Warrior. And that makes me very, very proud.”
And finally, Tom has a blog if you want to follow him, Meschery’s Musings on Sports, Literature and Life: https://mescherysmusings.blogspot.com/
Thanks all for your encouragement - I'm enjoying researching the players I know almost nothing about and the ones I thought I knew all about. And, it helps me pass the time since I'm not watching games a few hours a night.
Another prime example of the communal creative chops we keep coming back to at DNHQ. Now if you could only do a League wide jersey countup for each Dubs win when we start the regular season...
Probably won't have to worry about who wore #73, but you got me wondering what is the lowest number that has never been worn by an NBA player? Are they any or has every number been covered?
So, after a bit of clicking at basketball-reference.com, I'm pretty sure the following numbers have not been worn in the NBA:
58, 64, 68, 69, 74, 75, 78, 79, 80, 82, 87
Will the Dubs get to 58 wins this year? They got 67, 58, and 57 during the Durant years, and got 67 and 73 earlier in the dynasty, but it seems pretty unlikely. Unless they are getting 2010 CP3 and DH somehow.
I did not know who Tom Meschery was until now. The SI article on him is excellent reading. I love the contrast between the ‘ Mad Dog’ tough player and the poet and writer. Thanks for introducing me to this interesting person.
You have really outdone yourself DubsNerd. This is so full of great information. I am giving you a standing applause.
Amazing stuff, this has low-key become my favorite series to follow in the run up to training camp.
This is HIGH key (whatever that means) my favorite run up to training camp. Biggest props for all the links, details, and bios!
By the end of this, you'll have discussed every Tom Meschery, Dick Jefferson, and Harry Barnes!
(Edit to note again that this series is absolutely fantastic).
Haha, thanks, but Richard was #44 and Harrison was #40, so that was a bit outside my range
Excellent post. I'd never heard of the guy (I came into Dubnation with Run TMC).
Wait… a player from a prior era that’s NOT proclaiming that players today couldn’thack it in their era? Refreshing!
https://youtu.be/Ao5n_YSXdW0?si=OLPUuEj0Sgcjqo9l
YouTube on JK. I don't know the analyst, but he seems to be breaking down young players from different teams. It got me excited for year 4.
This year is only year 3 for him, though perhaps that will only make year 4 even more exciting!
doh, not sure how I messed that up, yep, looking forward to year 3. Well, year 4 too, but we have a bit of time until then.
Spoiler Alert
Lakers lose in 7 to the Boston Celtics in tonight’s episode of Winning Time
EDIT- Also it looks like thats it for Winning Time. they added a small snippet at the very end between Jeannie and Jerry then they summarized the rest of the Lakers history during final credits. I guess they got word the ghouls running HBO weren’t going to renew. Its ok though i just cancelled my Max subscription. Im only gonna miss the last season of Doom Patrol. They can shove their reality tv crap down their ******
EDIT 2
TVLine.com
@TVLine
Breaking: #WinningTime Cancelled After 2 Seasons at HBO
EDIT 3
We’ll probably not see a show of that scope and magnitude for a long while. Yeah you've got ur epic shows like Game of Thrones but a show that focuses on a singular genre like this with this type of casting
I'm downloading it as I write this. They must have come under a lot of pressure to pull the plug on one of the great farces to have ever been aired. They say America is the home of the free and brave. Never has there been more of break between the masses and their keepers on almost every level. Anyone enjoying a good comedy should watch this series.
> Never has there been more of break between the masses and their keepers on almost every level.
Lol. That’s a pretty dramatic way of saying it got cancelled cos its ratings were crappy, like thousands of other shows before it.
Did you even watch it?
I did — the first few episodes, anyway. Thought it was pretty well done — not engaging enough to keep me watching the full season, apparently, but pretty amusing for what it was.
But of course, how much I liked it is not really relevant to my comment. I’m just noting the fact that it was cancelled for lack of viewers relative to the cost of making the show — not for any other nefarious reason.
Rating were great. 8.3 on IMDB
That’s reviews from people who watched it, not ratings. The ratings (= # of eyeballs = $$$) were poor. That’s why shows get cancelled.
Whelp
Only Latrell Sprewell (#15) days left until training camp, and we are halfway through the final month of the off-season.
Another one of those "what could have been" players, and one of those "why do these bad things always happen to the Warriors" events. For so many years it seemed like it was just one thing after another.
In retrospect, with our better understanding of mental health issues, I feel sorry for him that he didn't have better support for working things out. But, it is always a balance, on the one hand, yes, clearly he had problems to have just snapped like that, but at the same time, he is responsible for his actions, and I'm never in support of violence for trying to solve a problem.
A result is, his ESPN biography mostly focuses on him assaulting a coach, rather than what he did on the court:
https://www.espn.com/classic/biography/s/Sprewell_Latrell.html
But, I'd rather remember his game, where he averaged 18 points a game and had some incredible on-court moments as a two-way player.
Here is a profile from 1997:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C8IBDLHvfFI
More from Basketball Time Machine:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I2_sxyjrKsk
And here is a grainy compilation of his Top 10 dunks:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UJGJcDWZTFQ
Interesting comparison. Choke a coach at practice, Commissioner suspends the player 82 games. Punch a teammate in the face (risking concussion or even murder), and a substantial bit of the vibe is when is that so-called "victim" gonna get the hell over it and play like he cares about the team?
It's stuff like this-a major punishment for assaulting management during practice, and "its an internal matter" for assaulting a worker during practice--that makes the NBA, for all its progressive posturing, continue to resemble a southern plantation or an exploitive sweat shop to some people.
Nah, Spree just chose workplace violence before it was cool.
Can't like this statement enough.
Anyway, it makes me happy that Spree found a home with the Knicks later on. PJ Carlesimo was notoriously a brutal coach, apparently borderline verbally abusive. I doubt Sprewell was the only player to want to choke the living sh*t out of him, he unfortunately was the only one to put thought into action.
One of my favorite warriors. I considered making my handle a spre reference!
There are so many times I wanted to choke and punch my highschool soccer coach, and probably would have had i not been a fairly timid child…. Maybe thats why at the time i completely blamed Carlisle :)
PJ Carlisimo, or maybe you really did blame Rick Carlisle. In that case my bad.
Haha yes carlisimo
Does anyone have an idea of where Garuba gets his shots from?
Is he a big that shoots from around the rim, but that's about it?
His shooting percentages are not terribly impressive, and on very low volume. In particular, his 2P% seems pretty low for a center.
I don't trust the stats much, though, since he only takes 2.5 shots a game. His per-36 rebounding number is nice, though (~12 rebounds).
Garuba career shot distribution
====
46% from 0-3ft (hits 54% of those)
17% from 3-10ft (32%)
0% from 10ft-3pt (0%)
36% from 3pt (37%)
Not exactly a mid-range demon, lol. The 3FG% is pretty encouraging, though, even if on low volume (79 career attempts).
Garuba wants to play like Draymond. Time will tell if the Warriors want him to play that way
I wish it were time that tells the warriors how to play, for now, its actually coach Kerr:-)
Father Time will tell...
Found this firsthand comment, which sounds encouraging:
@familygonzcartwright801 1 day ago
Alchemy, I'm from Spain, I've seen Garuba play in every game with the national team and every single game I thought, this guy is Draymond from Spain. Obviously, he is not there yet, but the main reason why he didn't play in Houston is precisely the way Houston was built, a player built for team play didn't fit in that Houston squad that was all young players trying to score.
Maybe it’s his Destiny to play like Draymond.
Excited for Garuba! Exactly the kind of player we should have used the second 2-way on. I think he has a fair shot to be utilized better with GSW than the Rockets.
Fun fact per bbref: His full name is Destiny Usman Garuba Alari.
Nice. Destiny’s Child!
Let’s get this right! HIS kid will be Destiny’s child :)
Ah, good point. Let me workshop it with Beyoncé...
Thanks, such an interesting analysis.
OT: hey dubby, I’m curious what your take on the State of California sueing Big Oil.
I mean, I feel like: about f’n time!
But I know you work to an extent in the renewables industry and am curious about your thoughts.
Ps I loved this article Joe V!
Lots of fans feeling like this off-season is going on forever, and we can't wait to see how the new Warriors TJD, Podz, and Usman will fit in, well, them and CP3, Dario, and Cory too, and maybe even Dwight Howard???
Well, hang in there, it's only Al Attles (#16) days until training camp. First it was back-to-back Brazilians, now it is back-to-back retired jerseys.
Al's nickname was "The Destroyer", and he was a menace on defense. He played for the Warriors for 11 years, coached for 13 years, and has stayed with the organization from 1960 until today. That's like, exactly my entire life, and I'm not young.
Somewhat unfortunately, probably his most famous highlight was an on-court altercation, but even that shows something about his personality. This was in game 4 of the 1975 finals, with the Warriors, coached by Al, up 3 - 0 on the Washington Bullets. Mike Riordan decided to jump Rick Barry, who was known to have a bit of a temper himself, and Al flew off the bench and got in the middle of it, probably to save Rick from retaliating and getting tossed. In the end, Al did get kicked out of the game, but in those days, this was not for coming off the bench and joining a fracas, but for continuing to argue with the ref. The Dubs managed to win that game without him on the sidelines, sweeping the Bullets for what was their last NBA championship for quite a few years.
Here's the fight:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uMfzATECQTw
And here is an article published a few weeks before the fight, titled "Attles Battles No Longer":
https://vault.si.com/vault/1975/04/21/attles-battles-no-longer
Oops, got that one wrong.
Here is a bit more about that '74-'75 Warriors team:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1kE7tjVtWk4
Also, there was no vet favoritism from this guy. From an NBA.com article (https://www.nba.com/warriors/news-blogs/al-attles-warriors-through-and-through-20190830):
---
Playing for Attles meant that everybody was involved; he frequently used rotations of 10-11 players, most of whom reached double-figures in minutes played. Warriors legend Rick Barry, who played both with and under Attles, put it this way: “We were a team of the highest order.”
“Everyone on that team knew that his time would come,” said Barry. “If you weren’t cutting it, someone else would get a shot. Al didn’t care who it was — and I should know.” In Game 7 of the 1975 Western Conference Finals against the Chicago Bulls, Barry, who had averaged over 30 points per game in the regular season, was benched by Attles after a cold shooting performance in the first half.
Barry continued: “Think about that. How many coaches would take their top player out of a game that important? But the guys picked me up.” That was The Al Attles Method.
---
Here is an NBCSBA video on Al:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5J1NCHtpbqg
And finally, for all of us JTA fans, we can also thank Al indirectly for Juan's love of basketball. In case you hadn't heard the story, Juan's third grade teacher was none other than Wilhelmina Attles, Al's wife, and she helped Juan attend a Warriors camp that really started his basketball career.
https://www.nba.com/warriors/news-blogs/juan-toscano-anderson-dubs-debut-20200210
Attles also holds an NBA record for combined points by teammates in one game (117). Of course, Wilt had 100 of those, but Attles was 8/8 from the field and hit his only FT for what we now call a Wiggins (17 points).
I was at that WCF Game 7 sitting in the rafters and witnessed an amazing comeback led by Phil Smith, Charles Dudley, and Derrick Dickey. The only reason I could get tickets was because Rick Barry had a brain fart on Game 5, causing the Dubs to lose and then have to fly to Chicago down 3-2. No one expected the Dubs to bounce back in Game 6 but they did so I called Ticketron on the phone to reserve tickets.
Awesome! Was that also in the Cow Palace, or did they get to play in Oakland for the WCF?
Also, lol'd at "a Wiggins", but man, that is so true. Dude gets 15 points in the first half, and sure enough he'll get 2 or 3 in the second.
Game was in Oakland. Did see Wilt, West, and Baylor at the Cow Palace the year they won 33 in a row ('71-'72).
Whoa 🤯
The Warriors version of "He did a Homer!" Needs to be added to the Dubtionary 📖
So two-ways are LQ and Garuba right? The Dubs still don't have a 14th, and the 15th will be vacant. When will we know whether the teams get two vs. three 2-way contracts to use?
For that 14th slot, either LQ or Garuba could get promoted, and then there's the laundry list of vets and youngsters that are in camp or doing tryouts for the Dubs.
Here’s CBS’ team evaluating Houston picking Our Guy Garuba two years ago. Avery Johnson compared him to Kenneth Faried and the other guy said he was the 3rd best defender in the draft (behind Mitchell and Mobley). https://youtu.be/wbGL--02kuQ?si=e8zQ3d8A0Iq62SUT
Faried seems like a terrible comp to me. iIRC, he was basically a true C in a 6-8 frame who had no discernible NBA skill other than rebounding and trying really hard. Garuba seems much closer to Dray$ than to Faried in typology and skillset (elite awareness and switchability on D; decent passing, handles, and 3 pt shooting on O) even if he never actually approaches Dray’s level.
I think he has a good chance of approaching Dray's level of 3 point shooting
Haha, true.
Garuba is an interesting pick up. He’s seems like the player Kerr has been (semi-successfully) trying to get Kuminga to be the last couple of years, but 1/10 the price and bigger/stronger. Kuminga’s offense may be the upside that gets him paid, but Garuba’s defense seems pretty playable right now.
LOOK AT THIS POINT I'LL LIVE WITH AN 0-82 SEASON I'M LOSING MY MIND LET'S GET THIS THING STARTED ALREADY
I’m glad there are the WNBA playoffs and my team, the Liberty, doing well.
Nice article on Vandersloot and the team.
https://www.espn.com/wnba/story/_/id/38393373/wnba-title-new-york-liberty-courtney-vandersloot
I want my bay area WNBA team damn it
Yes, and I want it in Oakland, not owned by J Lacob.
Your Liberty are looking scary, And1!
I'm also really enjoying Connecticut. The injury to Brionna Jones was a huge bummer, but it has sort of forced them into a play style that really feels like their destiny, with Alyssa Thomas as a point-center and shooters everywhere else. (Thomas, for those who haven't seen her, is one of the most unique players in the sport. Injuries to both shoulders have left her without a jump shot, but she's strong as hell, a great defender, and nearly led the league in assists. Not sure what the best NBA comp would be—maybe Draymond, maybe pre-meltdown Ben Simmons, but better than those guys relative to the league. She'll come in third in the MVP vote this year.)
Also sad the Mystics couldn't quite get healthy in time to gel this year. They'd be a fun potential spoiler at full health. Britney Sykes is my favorite player to watch in the W right now. A little like prime Iguodala, or Pippen.
Yes, injuries can be a real bummer for a team.
I have always enjoyed watching Diana Taurasi play.
The Liberty have now morphed into a team who, when playing their basketball style, have been described as playing ‘beautiful basketball.’. They depend a lot on the three point shot, sharing the ball, and lots of assists. Beautiful basketball. Who does that remind you of? That’s why I like this team.
Agree, Sabrina is very fun to watch. The other first round games are pretty lopsided, but should be over soon.
I also enjoy watching Marine Johannes. Truly unique.
I'm glad there's football.
I’ve forgotten. Is football the same as soccer? Or only in New Zealand? Or maybe this is some Olympics trial sport?
Yeah I wandered away from football for a couple of decades because violence and concussions but I’ve gotten interested a bit again and 9ers certainly seem legit
I did the same, but never wandered back. Has the whole violence and concussions things gotten any better?
No, I've just become a more callous human being.
Progress!
If nothing else, I’m pretty sure the arrival of Garuba means we’ll no longer be in the awkward position of wondering whether we should root for a credibly-accused rapist.
And there was much rejoicing.
I feel bad for Lamb, though. He has no way to exonerate himself if he isn't guilty. He just lives with it for the rest of his life, I guess.
I haven't heard Lamb mentioned anywhere as a possible Dub for this season anyway. Of course we don't know what the FO and Kerr have discussed but if they were considering him, they've been quiet about it.
What if he is guilty? Who do you feel bad for? Remember that the vast majority of accusations of rape are true ...
If Lamb is guilty of the rape, who do we feel bad for? This is such a stupid question, obviously the person who was raped.
I mean, a rhetorical question usually has an obvious answer… but in context, this feels like an attempt to invalidate g8tgod’s comment and redirect the conversation back to a presumption of guilt because “probability”, which is a mob mentality our legal system is deliberately setup to counteract.
> which is a mob mentality our legal system is deliberately setup to counteract.
Maybe, but in the case of rape the numbers do not suggest a bunch of innocent men being railroaded by mob mentality. quite the opposite.
Picking and choosing where to apply “guilt by probability” is a verrrry slippery slope, my friend… i understand you’ve got good intentions here, but I shudder at a society that approaches these problems in such ways…
You seem to have confused the terms rhetorical and stupid.
So you're rhetorically asking a stupid question?
Thats a bold strategy Cotton, lets see if it works out.
I already feel bad for the woman. I assumed we all did. I was just saying I felt for Lamb too. Once the allegation is made, he's already guilty as far as a lot of people are concerned.
Of course you can feel however you want. As she did not press charges we can not even fall back on the official outcome of a trial (though trials often seem to acquit rapists even when they committed the act).
But I don't understand your position. If he is a rapist, why do you feel bad for him? If she made it up, why do you feel bad for her?
My dude or dudette, I can’t find where g8tgod says that if the guy is an actual rapist, they feel bad for the guy. I read “He has no way to exonerate himself if he isn't guilty”, which is pretty clear to me.
Yeah, but I'm saying that's kind of backwards. I guess it's good that, at least on the surface, g8tgod, and others are not judging without proof, but you only feel bad for the guy if he's innocent. He's most likely guilty. In my opinion, stating that you feel bad for the guy is inferring that you think he's not guilty.
I'm saying that, most likely, a girl got raped, he did it and his only punishment is a bad reputation. Yeah, it's true that if he's innocent he doesn't really have any options and when the ratio of false reports of rape: real reports of rape gets closer to 1:1 than the current roughly 1:10 (and that's not including all the rapes that don't get reported!). I'll start to feel bad for the men.
(I suppose I should close with, I'm not trying to throw shade at g8tgod or others in this thread. empathy is a good thing. It's just that, in the case of rape, statistics say it is mostly misdirected. Based on current society, I wonder how long it would take, if the rape was established as fact before there would be some saying she asked for it?...)
People don't have to be black and white in their beliefs. There can be a lot of gray area.