Bunch of BS; if he was twisting and flailing to hit, he would have knocked him out. NBA just don't want to hear about anymore Warrior playoff runs...If Dray had knocked LBJ down in a Finals game, and, walked over him, what do you think would have happened to LBJ for reaching up to push Green off him...same sugar, different day....
EVERYBODY knows the Warriors gamble for this season/this team, is about the HOF ORIGINAL CORE....team was built around them for this season. EVERYBODY KNOWS you take DRAY out, you have mortally wounded this team. No matter what you do/add to this lineup, FOR THIS SEASON, you are not going anywhere. Reason why KERR AND LACOB didn't break down the NBA FO door and went along with the NBA narrative on Green one more time after he prevented the OTHER team's 7 footer from choking Klay. Problem is, ALL STAR game not withstanding, clearly, they have no friends in the NBA FO. There are other markets/players the NBA FO is trying to build/showcase were it not for ''Curry and those dang warriors & that dang ageless LBJ''. The Dray Narrative is convenient, again. Steve and Joe are learning you give them an arm, they want, they REALLY WANT the whole thing. First time anyone got suspended indefinitely for...'reckless' flailing.
I'm with you on the 2016 suspension being bogus. Green never even connected with LeBron, who went down like someone shot him. That he was able to later complain and get the NBA to do his bidding should have been embarrassing for the league.
But I'm not with you on Green's recent suspensions. Are they policing him more closely and punishing more severely than if it were someone else? Of course. But Draymond /knows/ that, and he does little to keep himself out of those situations or to mitigate the damage when he does. All of his justifications about him being him and knowing better than anyone how to be him don't help.
In the end, I'm sorry it has come to this but not sorry for Green at all. The guy has more money than he should ever reasonably be able to spend and has a very public platform from which to advocate for causes he cares about. He's got it great. Sucks for the Ws, but they hitched themselves to him knowing this could happen. Hopefully, the young guys developing into key players will offset the burden all of this becomes to his teammates and the franchise.
Partial like; 1st part of comment. 2nd part, they didn't ''hitch'' themselves to Green, they simply tolerated a long-ago-Green-NBA FO smoke-screen too long; a false-narrative at NBA FO developed since your 1st part of comment...on the winningest team of all-time no-less, homegrown, and, on, what was at the time, a shoe-string budget, and an owner that was a sage; the NBA FO FRONT DOOR WAS PAINTED GREEN SINCE THAT TIME....with ENVY!
Yeah that’s it. The league office personnel sit around and go “Warrior runs are bad for business” (which they’re not) and then they instruct the refs “Call whatever you can possibly get away with on Draymond.”
You got it right this time...dang right I do...I still have not forgiven the NBA for that Finals decision after LBJ cried to the media and the ring they gifted him as a direct result...
Don't smoke anything till you go back and slow-mo-view the play that cost us a 'Ship; the NBA has been trying to couch that decision with the ''bad boy'' narrative on Dray ever since. If it were LBJ, he would have played in game 5... As I said, this is all BS; same day, different sugar...
I wish not to start a fire, but this, now, is my team. This is the team that I will fall in love with. In the spring, Klay and Wiggs will be in love again too. And I want to reassure those who suffer of CPP (Curry Prime Panic): he's healthier than Lebron, and with the joy of playing that he has, He will play until 42, at the earliest. I accept bets.
I wonder if the issue with Curry will be not how long /can/ he play but how long does he want to play? If Klay and Draymond are diminished or end up elsewhere, does Steph want to have a final chapter with a new cast of characters, or will he decide that he has plenty of other things to succeed at -- golf, media, philanthropy, social activism?
Put another way, would you want to go out and get 30/5/5 and have to sit at the press conference answering questions about Green's behavior or whether Klay is distracted by contract concerns?
Those don’t worry me at all in Curry perspective. He’s the nicer guy ever, the perfect neighbor that not only comes with a big cake anda big smile at your parties, but also saves your little kid from drowning. He was ready to found the Splash Trio both with Dlo and with JP. And finally he will have a run for President of the United States, but not before 50.
I hope he /won't/ run for President. He might be able to win, given the celebrity culture and his high popularity. But I wouldn't wish that job on him.
Warriors are in a bad position. We are about to play lots of games with out our best defender and we already are a bad defensive team. Steph and klay out there together makes it difficult at that end already.
Benching klay and wiggs seems the right move, but i don't think klays ego Will take it very well.
We have lots of players that wants and need minutes, and that actually backfired us.
We don't have a consistent line up this year that has won us games and that You can rely on.
My choise going foward Will be Steph moody klay kuminga and looney.. but whatever kerr choises i hope we build a little consistency going foward and stick with it
I'd shake this up even more and go Steph, Paul, Moody, Kuminga, TJD and try to get some defensive presence early from TJD. Tell TJD his entire reason for existence is to block every shot in the paint early and often, not worry about fouls for the first six minutes, and see if you can't change the offensive flow toward the basket for the other team. Tell Steph to go ahead and go full green-light from the jump, contra to his usual build up, and force the other team to decide whether to keep all starters on the Court with the option to roll out Klay, Wiggs, Saric, Looney at 6-8 minutes.
If Klay and Wiggs are playing well, roll them over into the 2nd quarter with Paul's unit, and put even more pressure on the other teams' lineup decisions. If Klay is 0-198 from three after the 1st quarter, with an unconscionable number of missed jacked up fall-aways from 17 feet, and Wiggs has missed 87 bunnies around the rim, give their minutes in the 2nd and 3rd to Podz, Payton and Kuminga. Notably, under this setup, JK is in full try-out mode for the number 2 scorer position, and would end up playing at least 12 and up to 18-22 minutes in the first half - and probably 35-40 a game - if Kuminga can't be a number two consistent 20-plus per game scorer on this team I don't think there's anyone who can. It's time to lean in and see what we've got with him.
Everyone should be reasonably happy under this lineup except Klay (and Wiggs, who doesn't seem to be happy regardless, so who cares). Podz might see his role shrink a bit, but he's going to be in where either Klay or Wiggs is failing. If Podz doesn't get minutes, it's because GS is winning. Paul gets to start, JK gets his minutes to show what he can do as a legit two-way starter, with Paul for on-court support/court discipline early. Looney, who has never worried much about "starting" will get his minutes anyway through the game when TJD fouls out. And Klay has the full option to sulk, or to full-on embrace the microwave role and make something of his late career. If sulk is the option, I say GS doesn't owe him anything further. I saw an article recently claiming it would be the "ultimate betrayal" to trade Klay, but this is a team that paid him max dollars for two full unplayed seasons, on a contract it signed knowing he was going to miss at least one. Not saying they shouldn't have, and they got another championship for their money, but I think 90 million dollars for two seasons on injured reserve should leave GS' conscience clear. The "ultimate betrayal" would have been to offer Klay 15 million a year after he tore his ACL.
Well stated start to finish. Something dramatic needs to happen now and this new approach could potentially begin digging us out of the mess we are clearly in. If not, then on to something else. Barring trades, perhaps try out some free agents in the 15th spot when ten-day contracts begin soon. This period during the Green suspension should open the door for anything and everything.
I'm convinced that Michael Jordan, Phil Jackson and a locker room full of veterans were much better in handling Dennis Rodman than Steph, Klay and Steve Kerr
Well, that puts quite a pall on the remainder of the season. I'm no longer confident the team will pull together and finish strong. If you assume he won't be back, the remaining roster should be good enough for at least a play-in spot, but there's just no way the vibes on the team will be actually good with Draymond's situation hanging over them.
Draymond himself will feel persecuted by the league, doubtlessly, and somewhat understandably if you buy that this time it really was just an accident during reckless flailing. The OGs are too close with him, with too much shared history, to just cast him aside and move on. But it's obvious that there's no way he can reform to be the person the league as a whole expects and demands, or if he can it will come at the cost of the fire that, historically, made him a transcendent player.
It's perplexing how one man can embody such genius and idiocy at once.
I think the team would pull together and outperform people's expectations, IF Dray was really away from the team. With him attending practices (and probably continuing to stir the pot about how he feels he was mistreated) his teammates are kinda stuck. So, if that happens, they will probably underperform at home (kinda like last year). If he doesn't travel with the team, they might do better on the road. Might.
Poole and Dalton dropped a fact on Dubs Talk I didn't realize until now. Dray's been suspended 4 times in the past year. He's been suspended 5 times total in his career.
Things have been getting worse with Dray losing his cool and letting his emotions get the better of him on-court.
I'm beginning to suspect that something is going on in his personal life that has made him more emotional and more volatile on the court. If true, maybe he can get help, and that will change his on-court volatility, too.
I mean, I can't rule that out entirely but I also think the suspensions are coming more readily from the league thanks to the whole "history of play offenses" thing.
Another theory is that he used to think he had something to prove. But as a four-time champion and having won the most recent one after a lot of pundits had declared the end of the dynasty, he feels vindicated and doesn't care as much what others think. It kind of sounds like that with his "I know better than anyone how to be Draymond" justifications.
I've been very pro-Dray up until this point, but maybe the naysayers have a point.
-------EXCERPT---------
No matter what was transpiring around him, Green just went on and on about how Malik Monk had palmed the ball while coming down the floor and — like so many thousands of NBA players who came before him — wasn’t penalized. He re-enacted Monk’s carry in dramatic form for the officials — the same ones he’d spent nearly a minute before jawing at when a Trey Lyles elbow went uncalled and compelled Green to flop — and drew a technical foul from Mitchell Ervin that flipped the energy in the building. But that didn’t stop Green from, well, carrying on.
After Green was pulled from the game seconds later, he told Warriors coach Steve Kerr all about what Monk had done. He continued his anti-carrying crusade on the bench, where Green engaged in a spirited shouting match with player development coach Anthony Vereen that involved actual finger pointing in Green’s direction and was tense enough that Jonathan Kuminga and several others decided to play the part of peacemakers. Meanwhile, a Kings comeback from a 24-point deficit unfolded on the floor. The frustration on several nearby Warriors’ faces, among them Klay Thompson, was quite visible. And with good reason.
Immediately after that play, he overplayed near half court Monk and committed another foul...
EDIT: TBF, it was already a single digit game by that point, and the comeback was already in full swing... it's not like the Warriors were up 20 and the Kings went on a 25-4 blitz after this incident.
My cynical, anti-corporate greed rant…… So this year we have bad-boy-Ja and bad-boy-Draymond, who are going to be punished by really not-so-bad-boy Joe Dumars. Thus the league maintains its cleverly sanitized image. Corporations want to make money and these bad boys do not help make money. Luckily, bbJ and bbD did not really hurt anyone else. Not an excuse, just an observation.
But wait, someone in the last year gave himself permission to be a bad boy and cause real physical and excruciatingly painful damage to another player who was then rehabbing for months afterwards. How was King bad-boy-LeBron treated? I must’ve missed that news cycle, but as far as I I know the league did not call him out, they did not make an example of him, they did not suspend him for the rest of the playoffs, they did not exact a fine from him. Seems bad-boy-LeBron could be a very bad boy, but still be good for the image of the NBA.
So I see Draymond as often so reckless, often so out of control. IMO he’s also, inter Alia, a victim of corporate hypocrisy. What a waste.
Wondering how we gauge intent. IMO When Booker sneakily pushed a giant Center, forgot his name, onto Steph Curry, resulting in Steph‘s little hand being crushed by the giant….What was Booker’s intent? My recollection of the event was that he did not look like…gee, I can hardly wait to knock the shit out of you and put you out of Work for most of 2019/2020. Mauling a guy from behind when he elevates to make a basket, what is the intent? Is it just neutral, like maybe I can get this guy to stop jumping so high? So there are rules in place to keep people from Attacking quarterbacks and presumably this recognizes that certain kinds of actions are likely to have worse consequences than others, correct? Not a basketball or football player. But I think it’s difficult to specify the ‘intent’ when someone roughs up the quarterback. Similarly attacking a guy on the court with a football type tackle to the gut, which I have seen a couple of times in the last two years, is probably more likely to cause harm, than grabbing that guy around the waist to keep him from passing (or whatever). Where/when does a guy step over the line, deep down in his heart of hearts? “Only the Shadow knows”.
How do we gauge intent? Easy! If Draymond did it, it was intentional. If Jarret Allen does it, let's write a comical tweet about it with some fun emojis!
These guys need to stop looking at the prize (ring or contract) and instead play with joy. Play for each other. That's the only way out of doldrums for this team.
May be the benching and Dray's indefinite suspension makes Klay reassess what he wants in life.
He should be higher than that, imo. Haven’t examined the other guys that closely, but I wouldn’t be surprised if he’s ahead of all those guys in terms of positive impact on the scoreboard (podzitive impact?)
Did you just come up with his moniker? Ala Dick 'Night Train' Lane, Walt 'No-Neck' Williams and such I really like the ring of Brandin 'Podzitive Impact' Podziemski.
Wow. Maybe Dray hasn't been playing all that great this year.
So, in order to try and understand Dray's DRtg results this year, I decided to control specifically for the starting trio of Steph/Klay/Wiggs, and examined that trio's performance with and without Dray.
In NBA.com, I isolated those lineups, and calculated a weighted ORtg, Drtg, and Nrtg for those lineups based off minutes played (if anyone knows another way to calculate weighted average for these stats, plz let me know).
I will make one observation here in order to try and explain these because frankly, I'm flabbergasted that Dray hasn't made an impact on the defense of the Steph/Klay/Wiggs lineups.
The most common w/Dray lineup (133 MP) is the starters with a Drtg of 119. Next most common (25 MP) has JK with a Drtg of 113.
The most common w/o Dray lineup has CP instead of Dray(85 MP) and it's had an astounding 110 Drtg (as well as an Ortg of 126!!). The second most common has Moody w/the starters (20 MP) and a Drtg of 112.5.
CP's inclusion highlights the key issue here - turnovers.
with Dray Ast/TO ratio: 1.4
w/o Dray Ast/TO ratio: 2.506
This was calculated using a quick and dirty minutes weighting, not the actual totals, but tells the story pretty starkly regardless. In limited minutes so far this season, Dray's turnovers have killed any impact he's had on the defensive end of the floor, and his offensive contribution is worse than his replacements.
(repost b/c I didn't realize quite how bad it was until I just looked) People keep thinking the solution is to add players... unfortunately the solution is to subtract player(s), or to just play and pray. Wiggins, god love him, has been a fucking boat anchor dragging this team into oblivion, he's the *literal* worst qualified player in basketball right now by BPM, winning his season long race to disgrace with Jordan Poole.
Man, fuck the NBA for this. That is all.
Bunch of BS; if he was twisting and flailing to hit, he would have knocked him out. NBA just don't want to hear about anymore Warrior playoff runs...If Dray had knocked LBJ down in a Finals game, and, walked over him, what do you think would have happened to LBJ for reaching up to push Green off him...same sugar, different day....
100% agree Dino.
EVERYBODY knows the Warriors gamble for this season/this team, is about the HOF ORIGINAL CORE....team was built around them for this season. EVERYBODY KNOWS you take DRAY out, you have mortally wounded this team. No matter what you do/add to this lineup, FOR THIS SEASON, you are not going anywhere. Reason why KERR AND LACOB didn't break down the NBA FO door and went along with the NBA narrative on Green one more time after he prevented the OTHER team's 7 footer from choking Klay. Problem is, ALL STAR game not withstanding, clearly, they have no friends in the NBA FO. There are other markets/players the NBA FO is trying to build/showcase were it not for ''Curry and those dang warriors & that dang ageless LBJ''. The Dray Narrative is convenient, again. Steve and Joe are learning you give them an arm, they want, they REALLY WANT the whole thing. First time anyone got suspended indefinitely for...'reckless' flailing.
I'm with you on the 2016 suspension being bogus. Green never even connected with LeBron, who went down like someone shot him. That he was able to later complain and get the NBA to do his bidding should have been embarrassing for the league.
But I'm not with you on Green's recent suspensions. Are they policing him more closely and punishing more severely than if it were someone else? Of course. But Draymond /knows/ that, and he does little to keep himself out of those situations or to mitigate the damage when he does. All of his justifications about him being him and knowing better than anyone how to be him don't help.
In the end, I'm sorry it has come to this but not sorry for Green at all. The guy has more money than he should ever reasonably be able to spend and has a very public platform from which to advocate for causes he cares about. He's got it great. Sucks for the Ws, but they hitched themselves to him knowing this could happen. Hopefully, the young guys developing into key players will offset the burden all of this becomes to his teammates and the franchise.
Partial like; 1st part of comment. 2nd part, they didn't ''hitch'' themselves to Green, they simply tolerated a long-ago-Green-NBA FO smoke-screen too long; a false-narrative at NBA FO developed since your 1st part of comment...on the winningest team of all-time no-less, homegrown, and, on, what was at the time, a shoe-string budget, and an owner that was a sage; the NBA FO FRONT DOOR WAS PAINTED GREEN SINCE THAT TIME....with ENVY!
Yeah that’s it. The league office personnel sit around and go “Warrior runs are bad for business” (which they’re not) and then they instruct the refs “Call whatever you can possibly get away with on Draymond.”
Is this real? You really think this way?
You got it right this time...dang right I do...I still have not forgiven the NBA for that Finals decision after LBJ cried to the media and the ring they gifted him as a direct result...
Bring some of whatever you’re smoking to the DNHQ reunion, seems like good stuff
Don't smoke anything till you go back and slow-mo-view the play that cost us a 'Ship; the NBA has been trying to couch that decision with the ''bad boy'' narrative on Dray ever since. If it were LBJ, he would have played in game 5... As I said, this is all BS; same day, different sugar...
I wish not to start a fire, but this, now, is my team. This is the team that I will fall in love with. In the spring, Klay and Wiggs will be in love again too. And I want to reassure those who suffer of CPP (Curry Prime Panic): he's healthier than Lebron, and with the joy of playing that he has, He will play until 42, at the earliest. I accept bets.
I wonder if the issue with Curry will be not how long /can/ he play but how long does he want to play? If Klay and Draymond are diminished or end up elsewhere, does Steph want to have a final chapter with a new cast of characters, or will he decide that he has plenty of other things to succeed at -- golf, media, philanthropy, social activism?
Put another way, would you want to go out and get 30/5/5 and have to sit at the press conference answering questions about Green's behavior or whether Klay is distracted by contract concerns?
Those don’t worry me at all in Curry perspective. He’s the nicer guy ever, the perfect neighbor that not only comes with a big cake anda big smile at your parties, but also saves your little kid from drowning. He was ready to found the Splash Trio both with Dlo and with JP. And finally he will have a run for President of the United States, but not before 50.
I hope he /won't/ run for President. He might be able to win, given the celebrity culture and his high popularity. But I wouldn't wish that job on him.
Set the 3PM records out as far as you can… there’s plenty of motivation out there if you want to look for it
I don't doubt that there would be goals to shoot for if he wants them. He might like putting that 3PM record far, far away.
But he's got so many interests and things he's good at. I wouldn't blame him if he decided he wanted to take a shot a pro golf...
And have a 40% of hole-in-one?
I keep forgettin' things will never be the same again
Every time you're near ....Dray
Warriors are in a bad position. We are about to play lots of games with out our best defender and we already are a bad defensive team. Steph and klay out there together makes it difficult at that end already.
Benching klay and wiggs seems the right move, but i don't think klays ego Will take it very well.
We have lots of players that wants and need minutes, and that actually backfired us.
We don't have a consistent line up this year that has won us games and that You can rely on.
My choise going foward Will be Steph moody klay kuminga and looney.. but whatever kerr choises i hope we build a little consistency going foward and stick with it
I'd shake this up even more and go Steph, Paul, Moody, Kuminga, TJD and try to get some defensive presence early from TJD. Tell TJD his entire reason for existence is to block every shot in the paint early and often, not worry about fouls for the first six minutes, and see if you can't change the offensive flow toward the basket for the other team. Tell Steph to go ahead and go full green-light from the jump, contra to his usual build up, and force the other team to decide whether to keep all starters on the Court with the option to roll out Klay, Wiggs, Saric, Looney at 6-8 minutes.
If Klay and Wiggs are playing well, roll them over into the 2nd quarter with Paul's unit, and put even more pressure on the other teams' lineup decisions. If Klay is 0-198 from three after the 1st quarter, with an unconscionable number of missed jacked up fall-aways from 17 feet, and Wiggs has missed 87 bunnies around the rim, give their minutes in the 2nd and 3rd to Podz, Payton and Kuminga. Notably, under this setup, JK is in full try-out mode for the number 2 scorer position, and would end up playing at least 12 and up to 18-22 minutes in the first half - and probably 35-40 a game - if Kuminga can't be a number two consistent 20-plus per game scorer on this team I don't think there's anyone who can. It's time to lean in and see what we've got with him.
Everyone should be reasonably happy under this lineup except Klay (and Wiggs, who doesn't seem to be happy regardless, so who cares). Podz might see his role shrink a bit, but he's going to be in where either Klay or Wiggs is failing. If Podz doesn't get minutes, it's because GS is winning. Paul gets to start, JK gets his minutes to show what he can do as a legit two-way starter, with Paul for on-court support/court discipline early. Looney, who has never worried much about "starting" will get his minutes anyway through the game when TJD fouls out. And Klay has the full option to sulk, or to full-on embrace the microwave role and make something of his late career. If sulk is the option, I say GS doesn't owe him anything further. I saw an article recently claiming it would be the "ultimate betrayal" to trade Klay, but this is a team that paid him max dollars for two full unplayed seasons, on a contract it signed knowing he was going to miss at least one. Not saying they shouldn't have, and they got another championship for their money, but I think 90 million dollars for two seasons on injured reserve should leave GS' conscience clear. The "ultimate betrayal" would have been to offer Klay 15 million a year after he tore his ACL.
Well stated start to finish. Something dramatic needs to happen now and this new approach could potentially begin digging us out of the mess we are clearly in. If not, then on to something else. Barring trades, perhaps try out some free agents in the 15th spot when ten-day contracts begin soon. This period during the Green suspension should open the door for anything and everything.
Wiggins is so close to not having 100% negative net ratings with every single teammate!
He’s only .8 away from a zero net rating with CP3! Will this next one be the game Wiggins partners up with CP3 to have a positive outcome???
I'm convinced that Michael Jordan, Phil Jackson and a locker room full of veterans were much better in handling Dennis Rodman than Steph, Klay and Steve Kerr
The Bulls only had to deal with Rodman for three years though.
This is right.
But the Spurs of David Robinson failed in that
In last 55 games Wizards, Pistons and Spurs are combined for 1 - 54
Only win? Wizards over Pistons
Pistons 21 consecutive losses, Spurs 18
After the end of Kawhi era, Spurs have ever had a 40 win year?
1) let's not join them on this streak
2) let's not be the one to break the streak
Well, that puts quite a pall on the remainder of the season. I'm no longer confident the team will pull together and finish strong. If you assume he won't be back, the remaining roster should be good enough for at least a play-in spot, but there's just no way the vibes on the team will be actually good with Draymond's situation hanging over them.
Draymond himself will feel persecuted by the league, doubtlessly, and somewhat understandably if you buy that this time it really was just an accident during reckless flailing. The OGs are too close with him, with too much shared history, to just cast him aside and move on. But it's obvious that there's no way he can reform to be the person the league as a whole expects and demands, or if he can it will come at the cost of the fire that, historically, made him a transcendent player.
It's perplexing how one man can embody such genius and idiocy at once.
I think the team would pull together and outperform people's expectations, IF Dray was really away from the team. With him attending practices (and probably continuing to stir the pot about how he feels he was mistreated) his teammates are kinda stuck. So, if that happens, they will probably underperform at home (kinda like last year). If he doesn't travel with the team, they might do better on the road. Might.
It's physics. Accidents are waiting to happen.
Poole and Dalton dropped a fact on Dubs Talk I didn't realize until now. Dray's been suspended 4 times in the past year. He's been suspended 5 times total in his career.
Things have been getting worse with Dray losing his cool and letting his emotions get the better of him on-court.
I'm beginning to suspect that something is going on in his personal life that has made him more emotional and more volatile on the court. If true, maybe he can get help, and that will change his on-court volatility, too.
I mean, I can't rule that out entirely but I also think the suspensions are coming more readily from the league thanks to the whole "history of play offenses" thing.
Another theory is that as he loses a step, he gets more insecure.
Another theory is that he used to think he had something to prove. But as a four-time champion and having won the most recent one after a lot of pundits had declared the end of the dynasty, he feels vindicated and doesn't care as much what others think. It kind of sounds like that with his "I know better than anyone how to be Draymond" justifications.
Insecure?
Or frustrated?
Or both. I mean, many of us said the Poole punch was driven by insecurity, and were shouted into silence. Well, . . .
> driven by insecurity, and were shouted into silence
Okay. Ummmmm.....
Amick chimes in with his 2 cents and ties Dray's tech against the Kings as one of the reasons that the Dubs lost their 24 pt lead.
https://theathletic.com/5135652/2023/12/13/draymond-green-suspension-warriors-jusuf-nurkic/
I've been very pro-Dray up until this point, but maybe the naysayers have a point.
-------EXCERPT---------
No matter what was transpiring around him, Green just went on and on about how Malik Monk had palmed the ball while coming down the floor and — like so many thousands of NBA players who came before him — wasn’t penalized. He re-enacted Monk’s carry in dramatic form for the officials — the same ones he’d spent nearly a minute before jawing at when a Trey Lyles elbow went uncalled and compelled Green to flop — and drew a technical foul from Mitchell Ervin that flipped the energy in the building. But that didn’t stop Green from, well, carrying on.
After Green was pulled from the game seconds later, he told Warriors coach Steve Kerr all about what Monk had done. He continued his anti-carrying crusade on the bench, where Green engaged in a spirited shouting match with player development coach Anthony Vereen that involved actual finger pointing in Green’s direction and was tense enough that Jonathan Kuminga and several others decided to play the part of peacemakers. Meanwhile, a Kings comeback from a 24-point deficit unfolded on the floor. The frustration on several nearby Warriors’ faces, among them Klay Thompson, was quite visible. And with good reason.
Immediately after that play, he overplayed near half court Monk and committed another foul...
EDIT: TBF, it was already a single digit game by that point, and the comeback was already in full swing... it's not like the Warriors were up 20 and the Kings went on a 25-4 blitz after this incident.
Yeah that was a weird incident. I think the guy has truly lost it
My cynical, anti-corporate greed rant…… So this year we have bad-boy-Ja and bad-boy-Draymond, who are going to be punished by really not-so-bad-boy Joe Dumars. Thus the league maintains its cleverly sanitized image. Corporations want to make money and these bad boys do not help make money. Luckily, bbJ and bbD did not really hurt anyone else. Not an excuse, just an observation.
But wait, someone in the last year gave himself permission to be a bad boy and cause real physical and excruciatingly painful damage to another player who was then rehabbing for months afterwards. How was King bad-boy-LeBron treated? I must’ve missed that news cycle, but as far as I I know the league did not call him out, they did not make an example of him, they did not suspend him for the rest of the playoffs, they did not exact a fine from him. Seems bad-boy-LeBron could be a very bad boy, but still be good for the image of the NBA.
So I see Draymond as often so reckless, often so out of control. IMO he’s also, inter Alia, a victim of corporate hypocrisy. What a waste.
I missed this too... who did KbbL injure?
Wiggins
Joke, right?
not sure if DFiB was joking, but I'm ashamed to admit I legitimately don't remember what you're talking about...
He injured Wiggins… I’d wiped that stain from my memory…
KbbL is indeed the Chosen One, but I don’t believe he had actual intent to injure Wiggins…
Wondering how we gauge intent. IMO When Booker sneakily pushed a giant Center, forgot his name, onto Steph Curry, resulting in Steph‘s little hand being crushed by the giant….What was Booker’s intent? My recollection of the event was that he did not look like…gee, I can hardly wait to knock the shit out of you and put you out of Work for most of 2019/2020. Mauling a guy from behind when he elevates to make a basket, what is the intent? Is it just neutral, like maybe I can get this guy to stop jumping so high? So there are rules in place to keep people from Attacking quarterbacks and presumably this recognizes that certain kinds of actions are likely to have worse consequences than others, correct? Not a basketball or football player. But I think it’s difficult to specify the ‘intent’ when someone roughs up the quarterback. Similarly attacking a guy on the court with a football type tackle to the gut, which I have seen a couple of times in the last two years, is probably more likely to cause harm, than grabbing that guy around the waist to keep him from passing (or whatever). Where/when does a guy step over the line, deep down in his heart of hearts? “Only the Shadow knows”.
How do we gauge intent? Easy! If Draymond did it, it was intentional. If Jarret Allen does it, let's write a comical tweet about it with some fun emojis!
These guys need to stop looking at the prize (ring or contract) and instead play with joy. Play for each other. That's the only way out of doldrums for this team.
May be the benching and Dray's indefinite suspension makes Klay reassess what he wants in life.
Podz is #9 in NBA's rookie ladder:
https://www.nba.com/news/kia-rookie-ladder-dec-13-2023-edition
He should be higher than that, imo. Haven’t examined the other guys that closely, but I wouldn’t be surprised if he’s ahead of all those guys in terms of positive impact on the scoreboard (podzitive impact?)
On court / net on-off per 100 possessions
Player A +8.9 / +2.5
Player B -10.7 / +2.8
Player C +9.8 / +13.5
A is Chet, B is Wemby, C is Podz.
“(podzitive impact?)”
Just couldn’t help yourself huh? 😂
Did you just come up with his moniker? Ala Dick 'Night Train' Lane, Walt 'No-Neck' Williams and such I really like the ring of Brandin 'Podzitive Impact' Podziemski.
Surprising they don't have Wallace in there...
Predictions for next games starting 5?
Here's mine: CP/Steph/Moody/JK/Loon
which leaves a bench squad of CoJo/Klay/Wiggs/Saric/TJD.
That bench looks to be an unmitigated disaster, but maybe we'll finally start winning the Steph minutes again.
Podz is on the bench, too.
Steph - Klay - Wiggs - JK - Loon
You've left out Podz, who is going to play 25-30 mpg.
I knew I was missing someone. lol.
Nah. Kerr is not going to drop Klay like a hot potato. Klay may not close but he will start for sure.
For the first quarter, my guess is:
CP-Steph-Klay-Wiggs-Loon.
For third:
Same but with JK instead of Loon.
Might swap Wiggins out... and if going JK for on ball defense, might go Saric.
Agree
Wow. Maybe Dray hasn't been playing all that great this year.
So, in order to try and understand Dray's DRtg results this year, I decided to control specifically for the starting trio of Steph/Klay/Wiggs, and examined that trio's performance with and without Dray.
In NBA.com, I isolated those lineups, and calculated a weighted ORtg, Drtg, and Nrtg for those lineups based off minutes played (if anyone knows another way to calculate weighted average for these stats, plz let me know).
Steph/Wiggs/Klay/Dray lineups: 199 MP, 111 ORtg, 121 DRtg, -10 NetRtg
Steph/Wiggs/Klay/No-Dray: 174 MP, 113 ORtg, 121 DRtg, -8 NetRtg
I stand corrected.
I will make one observation here in order to try and explain these because frankly, I'm flabbergasted that Dray hasn't made an impact on the defense of the Steph/Klay/Wiggs lineups.
The most common w/Dray lineup (133 MP) is the starters with a Drtg of 119. Next most common (25 MP) has JK with a Drtg of 113.
The most common w/o Dray lineup has CP instead of Dray(85 MP) and it's had an astounding 110 Drtg (as well as an Ortg of 126!!). The second most common has Moody w/the starters (20 MP) and a Drtg of 112.5.
CP's inclusion highlights the key issue here - turnovers.
with Dray Ast/TO ratio: 1.4
w/o Dray Ast/TO ratio: 2.506
This was calculated using a quick and dirty minutes weighting, not the actual totals, but tells the story pretty starkly regardless. In limited minutes so far this season, Dray's turnovers have killed any impact he's had on the defensive end of the floor, and his offensive contribution is worse than his replacements.
(repost b/c I didn't realize quite how bad it was until I just looked) People keep thinking the solution is to add players... unfortunately the solution is to subtract player(s), or to just play and pray. Wiggins, god love him, has been a fucking boat anchor dragging this team into oblivion, he's the *literal* worst qualified player in basketball right now by BPM, winning his season long race to disgrace with Jordan Poole.
Amen 🙏