I’m really curious about why returning players need to play to get in game shape - seemingly most of them at the start of the season. It often takes 10-15 games for players to get passed the ‘gassed quickly’ phase. The really disciplined players (like GP2 it seems) who prepare themselves and are in ‘game shape’ early can do well at the start of the season.
Check out this article by an Olympic distance skater (multiple gold medalist and world record setter) about what it takes to be in insane aerobic shape. I’d love for the Dubs to see this.
Look, I'm a Wiseman hater. I hated the pick at the time and nothing last year has really changed my mind. Here are my problems with Wiseman last year:
1) His shot selection was awful last year. He averaged more than 2 dunks a game and his TS% was still below average.
2) Defense. The game was just too fast for him last year. He constantly fouled. 5.2 fouls/36. And his being out of position consistently led to bigs destroying us inside. 113 defensive rating when he was on the court.
3) His rebounding. When on the court last year, the Dubs got out-rebounded by 6%. They were outrebounded without Wise too, but they performed better on the boards when he was off the court.
4) His complete lack of vision. He's a black hole on offense averaging 1.1 AST/36. That's worse than Oubre. Combined with 2.6 TOV/36, that's a recipe for disaster in the Kerr offense.
5) His FT%. Low 60's means his jump shot may simply be bad. And he's in love with it. Which leads to issue #1.
The problem with all of those is how much you can improve on those while not actually playing against NBA caliber competition at full speed. He is physically capable of doing things very few human beings can do. But reading an offense of NBA athletes moving at full speed? Can you really improve that solely watching tape or at walking pace while also rehabbing your knee? I think to have any chance to prove me wrong, he's gonna need just a ton of full speed reps and that means G-League, summer league, training camp, scrimmages. And it means he needs a full summer of playing before I'd give him meaningful minutes in any game that truly mattered.
0:00 Wiseman wins the tip-off. This should be a gimme, every night.
0:00-11:41 - First play. JW sets three screens in a row, two off-ball and then an on-ball screen that allows the ball handler to get to the hoop and score in traffic.
- 11:24 - Plays drop coverage across the paint. Tries to box out, but gets pushed towards the basket, and the shot banks off the rim, going over his head. He could've (A) held his position better, and (B) jumped preemptively to grab the rebound knowing that he had teammates to either side of him to grab a clank off the side.
- 11:17 - Runs fast in transition, and receives a poor pass as he enters the paint. He has to reach behind him, seems to catch the ball, but fumbles it heading up to the rim and ball goes OOB. It almost looks like it was poked by the trailing defender, but on replay, it looks like a pure fumble.
- 11:04 - Drops too aggressively defending the driver, IMO, but it's a miss. Fails to box-out and the rebound goes to ACC right in a spot where Wiseman would've been if he had boxed out.
X - 10:29 - Plays good drop defense, and forces the driver to change his shot, clanking it.
- 10:16 - Slightly slow for an on-ball screen which the defender easily slips. Cuts slowly to the basket, but the ball handler misses the pass, anyways, drive and kick.
X - 9:42 - takes up a position on the low post, and just kinda wanders around between there and the short corner, watching the ball bounce around the perimeter. Missed the opportunity for a baseline cross-screen that woulda sprung free a three from the corner.
9:36 - good box out.
9:18 - drops too far defending a screen and the ball handler pulls up from the elbow with a wide open shot (JW backpedals halfway to the basket)
- 9:06 on-ball pick and roll, receives a poorly thrown/timed ally-top and tries to off-balance left-handed heave to the basket but misses.
- 8:54 beautiful late rotation, recovery, and block.
- 8:29 once again, drops too deep on a screen-switch, miss this time, gets pushed away back under the basket on the rebound - another failed box-out that might've resulted in a rebound.
- 7:54 no-look pass in transition leads JW by too much, and he misses it. Can't tell whether JW slowed, or the teammate just overthrew. This is just learning to play together.
2:10-1:52 checks back in - once again drops too deep on a screen-switch at the wing, but ball handler misses.
- 1:45. Pick and roll, receives the pass on roll, and doesn't go up aggressively enough, rejected/stripped at the hoop.
- 1:38 DROPS TOO DEEP on a screen-switch at the elbow-wing. This is getting tedious.
- 1:27 receives the ball just inside elbow, aggressively goes up to score AND ONE through contact. Flashes a smile after the shot. Hits FT.
- 1:12. Clippers keep attacking Wiseman on these switches at the wing. This time, the big rolls, and it's not clear whether JW was too deep. He defended the roll-man, and arguably another Dub shoulda rotated.
- 0:59 fails to pick up a guard in transition who spots up for a wide open 3 on the wing. misses.
- 0:41 open under the basket in transition, teammates don't see him, ball swings around perimeter - corner 3 miss. Rebound goes right to Wiseman, but a Clipper gets up and knocks it from his hands OOB. Warrior ball. Poor rebound.
- 0:33 Starts at elbow, misses opp for on-ball screen or p'n'r. Misses pop for a cut to the basket on the drive - stands at FT line, receives the kick, and misses the elbow jumper.
- 0:23 once again gets attacked on screen-switch at the top of the key, drops too deep, but still forces a miss.
Last play of Q1: gets attacked on screen-switch again, drops out of the play, but the screened defender fights back to contest the shot. jumper goes in from the FT line while JW watches from under the basket.
Q2 - 11:30 - misses an easy ally-top. Can't tell why. Did he jump too early? Not aggressively enough? Just miss it going down? Was the pass too high? It's an ugly look, regardless.
X - 6:54 - subbed back in, correctly switches off his guy on a drive to contest an open layup, driver passes to his guy who puts it in easily.
- 6:30 tries to set a cross-screen, but doesn't realize ACC is in a zone. Pass to JW along the baseline is kicked.
- 6:20 tries a couple screens while milling around the FT line/top of the key, but it seems like SCW is struggling with penetrating the zone. JW finally receives the ball on the FT line with a man to beat, but surrounded by red jerseys 4-6 feet away. I would've loved to see him attack the basket and try to beat his man, but he wisely chooses to kick the ball back out. Gets it back at the top of the key with 4 seconds on the shot clock and immediately turns and fires a long 2pter that misses.
6:09(!!!) Finally jumps out at the ballhandler on a screen-switch but it becomes a double-team, and ACC finds the open man for a 3.
5:39 ticky-tack travel call on JW at the FT line. On replay, it looks like he jumps just as he's catching the ball, but the ref saw it as just after.
- 5:25 rotates off his man to unnecessarily help on the drive, but luckily the driver didn't see and the kick goes back to the perimeter.
- 4:50 gets out jumped for a defensive rebound.
- 4:23 Defense - screen-switch on the wing, drops too deep. elbow jumper is good. This is getting old.
X - 3:43 Offense: off-ball screen becomes on-ball screen, with enough space for a JP/Steph/Klay 3P'er, but the SC ball handler drives and hands off instead.
X - 3:23 Offense: catches the ball under the hoop in semi-transition. Good contested catch in traffic. Is double-teamed, so chooses to pass out, but fumbles the pass and hits an ACC player at the elbow for an easy transition basket.
Halftime.
I, umm, really wanted to watch the whole game, but this is really disheartening, and I think I'm out. LOL.
TLDR: Consistently drops too deep on defense when the offense forces a switch on a screen, allowing easy pull-up jumpers from the elbow/FT line. Doesn't box out well - often loses position and gets pushed around, even though he's the biggest guy out there. Fights decently for rebounds. Has fumbled multiple transition passes - can't tell whether it's chemistry and timing or poor hands - probably both. Occasionally wanders around looking lost. That was a really disappointing first half.
Why cant wiseman develop a KAT like post game in which hes not even the main focus on offense? If draymond is handling the ball, eiseman sets a screen on the wing for curry they absolutely can not switch that anymore or they will be punished inside, Wiseman's potential is that he can literally take away the one thing that gives the warriors offense trouble, which is switching
I'm sold on wiseman, all the complaints on him are stuff that will get ironed out with experience, the touch he is showing and some of these post moves with such little experience shows just how much potential he has
I’ve been a Wiseman defender/apologist, but his troubles hanging on to rebounds and balls thrown to him are a concern. It looks like he’s regressed. I know it’s only his 3rd game, but working on his hand-eye coordination with drills seems like the one skill he could have done during most of the time while he was rehabbing
Hey Abbadon I thought Of you earlier because I’m watching this game on ESPN Plus here in Columbia Mo and there was this local ad that came on for Rottler Pest Solutions and their opening line was “With global climate change, we are starting to see pest issues year round”. Man about the only people that believe in global
Climate change around these parts are people that live within a couple
In other news Steph passed Antawn Jamison and Tom Chambers on the all-time scoring list last game to vault into 47th. He’s 346 points behind Joe Johnson, so would need to average 24.7 ppg over the last 14 to pass him.
I wonder who sold the city of Ontario on the idea of having an nba sized arena. I drive by that arena on the way in and out of California when im out in Texas and I’ve always thought “Why is there a big ass arena in the outskirts of the Inland Empire?”
I'd love to see Wiseman try to do actual Warriors basketball things like off-ball screens and split cuts, but it appears this SCW squad is incapable of running GSW offense.
Watching Wiseman play this game was so frustrating since he had SO many unforced errors (two blown lobs) and legit 5 times where he failed to catch/secure the ball and then a traveling call/three second in paint
Like if it wasnt for all these mistakes his game wouldn't have been that bad at all with 15 points/9 rebounds/3 blocks in 21 minutes.
He honestly needs minutes/reps to cut out all these stupid mistakes + constant work/focus on his butterfinger hands and he would be quite the positive prospect even with his defensive miscues.
Defensively he was much better in terms of pick/roll defense and rim protection helping from the weakside. Still not that great but better than before and far more palatable for the NBA.
Looking back at the 2020 Draft class and knowing what we know now about those players, would y’all take any of the other lottery picks over Wiseman?
I’m really curious about why returning players need to play to get in game shape - seemingly most of them at the start of the season. It often takes 10-15 games for players to get passed the ‘gassed quickly’ phase. The really disciplined players (like GP2 it seems) who prepare themselves and are in ‘game shape’ early can do well at the start of the season.
Check out this article by an Olympic distance skater (multiple gold medalist and world record setter) about what it takes to be in insane aerobic shape. I’d love for the Dubs to see this.
https://www.howtoskate.se/_files/ugd/e11bfe_b783631375f543248e271f440bcd45c5.pdf
Look, I'm a Wiseman hater. I hated the pick at the time and nothing last year has really changed my mind. Here are my problems with Wiseman last year:
1) His shot selection was awful last year. He averaged more than 2 dunks a game and his TS% was still below average.
2) Defense. The game was just too fast for him last year. He constantly fouled. 5.2 fouls/36. And his being out of position consistently led to bigs destroying us inside. 113 defensive rating when he was on the court.
3) His rebounding. When on the court last year, the Dubs got out-rebounded by 6%. They were outrebounded without Wise too, but they performed better on the boards when he was off the court.
4) His complete lack of vision. He's a black hole on offense averaging 1.1 AST/36. That's worse than Oubre. Combined with 2.6 TOV/36, that's a recipe for disaster in the Kerr offense.
5) His FT%. Low 60's means his jump shot may simply be bad. And he's in love with it. Which leads to issue #1.
The problem with all of those is how much you can improve on those while not actually playing against NBA caliber competition at full speed. He is physically capable of doing things very few human beings can do. But reading an offense of NBA athletes moving at full speed? Can you really improve that solely watching tape or at walking pace while also rehabbing your knee? I think to have any chance to prove me wrong, he's gonna need just a ton of full speed reps and that means G-League, summer league, training camp, scrimmages. And it means he needs a full summer of playing before I'd give him meaningful minutes in any game that truly mattered.
Watching the replay of Wiseman's work tonight:
0:00 Wiseman wins the tip-off. This should be a gimme, every night.
0:00-11:41 - First play. JW sets three screens in a row, two off-ball and then an on-ball screen that allows the ball handler to get to the hoop and score in traffic.
- 11:24 - Plays drop coverage across the paint. Tries to box out, but gets pushed towards the basket, and the shot banks off the rim, going over his head. He could've (A) held his position better, and (B) jumped preemptively to grab the rebound knowing that he had teammates to either side of him to grab a clank off the side.
- 11:17 - Runs fast in transition, and receives a poor pass as he enters the paint. He has to reach behind him, seems to catch the ball, but fumbles it heading up to the rim and ball goes OOB. It almost looks like it was poked by the trailing defender, but on replay, it looks like a pure fumble.
- 11:04 - Drops too aggressively defending the driver, IMO, but it's a miss. Fails to box-out and the rebound goes to ACC right in a spot where Wiseman would've been if he had boxed out.
X - 10:29 - Plays good drop defense, and forces the driver to change his shot, clanking it.
- 10:16 - Slightly slow for an on-ball screen which the defender easily slips. Cuts slowly to the basket, but the ball handler misses the pass, anyways, drive and kick.
X - 9:42 - takes up a position on the low post, and just kinda wanders around between there and the short corner, watching the ball bounce around the perimeter. Missed the opportunity for a baseline cross-screen that woulda sprung free a three from the corner.
9:36 - good box out.
9:18 - drops too far defending a screen and the ball handler pulls up from the elbow with a wide open shot (JW backpedals halfway to the basket)
- 9:06 on-ball pick and roll, receives a poorly thrown/timed ally-top and tries to off-balance left-handed heave to the basket but misses.
- 8:54 beautiful late rotation, recovery, and block.
- 8:29 once again, drops too deep on a screen-switch, miss this time, gets pushed away back under the basket on the rebound - another failed box-out that might've resulted in a rebound.
- 7:54 no-look pass in transition leads JW by too much, and he misses it. Can't tell whether JW slowed, or the teammate just overthrew. This is just learning to play together.
2:10-1:52 checks back in - once again drops too deep on a screen-switch at the wing, but ball handler misses.
- 1:45. Pick and roll, receives the pass on roll, and doesn't go up aggressively enough, rejected/stripped at the hoop.
- 1:38 DROPS TOO DEEP on a screen-switch at the elbow-wing. This is getting tedious.
- 1:27 receives the ball just inside elbow, aggressively goes up to score AND ONE through contact. Flashes a smile after the shot. Hits FT.
- 1:12. Clippers keep attacking Wiseman on these switches at the wing. This time, the big rolls, and it's not clear whether JW was too deep. He defended the roll-man, and arguably another Dub shoulda rotated.
- 0:59 fails to pick up a guard in transition who spots up for a wide open 3 on the wing. misses.
- 0:41 open under the basket in transition, teammates don't see him, ball swings around perimeter - corner 3 miss. Rebound goes right to Wiseman, but a Clipper gets up and knocks it from his hands OOB. Warrior ball. Poor rebound.
- 0:33 Starts at elbow, misses opp for on-ball screen or p'n'r. Misses pop for a cut to the basket on the drive - stands at FT line, receives the kick, and misses the elbow jumper.
- 0:23 once again gets attacked on screen-switch at the top of the key, drops too deep, but still forces a miss.
Last play of Q1: gets attacked on screen-switch again, drops out of the play, but the screened defender fights back to contest the shot. jumper goes in from the FT line while JW watches from under the basket.
Q2 - 11:30 - misses an easy ally-top. Can't tell why. Did he jump too early? Not aggressively enough? Just miss it going down? Was the pass too high? It's an ugly look, regardless.
X - 6:54 - subbed back in, correctly switches off his guy on a drive to contest an open layup, driver passes to his guy who puts it in easily.
- 6:30 tries to set a cross-screen, but doesn't realize ACC is in a zone. Pass to JW along the baseline is kicked.
- 6:20 tries a couple screens while milling around the FT line/top of the key, but it seems like SCW is struggling with penetrating the zone. JW finally receives the ball on the FT line with a man to beat, but surrounded by red jerseys 4-6 feet away. I would've loved to see him attack the basket and try to beat his man, but he wisely chooses to kick the ball back out. Gets it back at the top of the key with 4 seconds on the shot clock and immediately turns and fires a long 2pter that misses.
6:09(!!!) Finally jumps out at the ballhandler on a screen-switch but it becomes a double-team, and ACC finds the open man for a 3.
5:39 ticky-tack travel call on JW at the FT line. On replay, it looks like he jumps just as he's catching the ball, but the ref saw it as just after.
- 5:25 rotates off his man to unnecessarily help on the drive, but luckily the driver didn't see and the kick goes back to the perimeter.
- 4:50 gets out jumped for a defensive rebound.
- 4:23 Defense - screen-switch on the wing, drops too deep. elbow jumper is good. This is getting old.
X - 3:43 Offense: off-ball screen becomes on-ball screen, with enough space for a JP/Steph/Klay 3P'er, but the SC ball handler drives and hands off instead.
X - 3:23 Offense: catches the ball under the hoop in semi-transition. Good contested catch in traffic. Is double-teamed, so chooses to pass out, but fumbles the pass and hits an ACC player at the elbow for an easy transition basket.
Halftime.
I, umm, really wanted to watch the whole game, but this is really disheartening, and I think I'm out. LOL.
TLDR: Consistently drops too deep on defense when the offense forces a switch on a screen, allowing easy pull-up jumpers from the elbow/FT line. Doesn't box out well - often loses position and gets pushed around, even though he's the biggest guy out there. Fights decently for rebounds. Has fumbled multiple transition passes - can't tell whether it's chemistry and timing or poor hands - probably both. Occasionally wanders around looking lost. That was a really disappointing first half.
Curious to know whatever the bet is that Steph and Dray must have on the Mich St. vs Davidson in first round of the tournament.
Why cant wiseman develop a KAT like post game in which hes not even the main focus on offense? If draymond is handling the ball, eiseman sets a screen on the wing for curry they absolutely can not switch that anymore or they will be punished inside, Wiseman's potential is that he can literally take away the one thing that gives the warriors offense trouble, which is switching
I needed a refresher after watching the SCW game.
https://www.instagram.com/reel/CbDjo8WA_RP/?utm_medium=copy_link
I'm sold on wiseman, all the complaints on him are stuff that will get ironed out with experience, the touch he is showing and some of these post moves with such little experience shows just how much potential he has
I’ve been a Wiseman defender/apologist, but his troubles hanging on to rebounds and balls thrown to him are a concern. It looks like he’s regressed. I know it’s only his 3rd game, but working on his hand-eye coordination with drills seems like the one skill he could have done during most of the time while he was rehabbing
Hey Abbadon I thought Of you earlier because I’m watching this game on ESPN Plus here in Columbia Mo and there was this local ad that came on for Rottler Pest Solutions and their opening line was “With global climate change, we are starting to see pest issues year round”. Man about the only people that believe in global
Climate change around these parts are people that live within a couple
Miles radius of Mizzou
Is Wiseman on a minutes limit? Is that why he's not in the closing lineup?
Lol, that announcer, for him it's a close game up 18 with 2 mins to go because the Dubs can shoot 3
In other news Steph passed Antawn Jamison and Tom Chambers on the all-time scoring list last game to vault into 47th. He’s 346 points behind Joe Johnson, so would need to average 24.7 ppg over the last 14 to pass him.
I wonder who sold the city of Ontario on the idea of having an nba sized arena. I drive by that arena on the way in and out of California when im out in Texas and I’ve always thought “Why is there a big ass arena in the outskirts of the Inland Empire?”
I'd love to see Wiseman try to do actual Warriors basketball things like off-ball screens and split cuts, but it appears this SCW squad is incapable of running GSW offense.
Watching Wiseman play this game was so frustrating since he had SO many unforced errors (two blown lobs) and legit 5 times where he failed to catch/secure the ball and then a traveling call/three second in paint
Like if it wasnt for all these mistakes his game wouldn't have been that bad at all with 15 points/9 rebounds/3 blocks in 21 minutes.
He honestly needs minutes/reps to cut out all these stupid mistakes + constant work/focus on his butterfinger hands and he would be quite the positive prospect even with his defensive miscues.
Defensively he was much better in terms of pick/roll defense and rim protection helping from the weakside. Still not that great but better than before and far more palatable for the NBA.