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I originally left this comment on the Warriors reddit page, but I'll leave it here too.

For purely selfish reasons I don't want the Warriors to get Gordon because my girlfriend thinks he's hot and I don't want to hear her say that about him every time we watch a game together.

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Lol. I know how you feel. My ex was hot for Beans back in the day. I managed floor seats one game ...wasnt fun lol. Guess thats why shes an ex! Lol. I just made fun of how bad he was...airing FT's all night...

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Argh, I can’t find where someone wrote a comment saying AG isn’t 6’11” as I previously wrote — gotta talk to Substack about their “Reply” button from the email notifications. But yeah, I have no idea what I was thinking when I wrote that. AG is, per Google search, 6’8” with a 7-foot wingspan. My point was that he’s long, which is part of the Warriors’ (defensive) philosophy on obtaining players. Also maybe I was thinking wingspan. Or it was a simple brain fart. Anyways, glad someone pointed it out. Overall, gotta admit when the comments get a little flooded, I tend to tune out, so I haven’t kept up and like on Twitter, I don’t want to get dragged into a back-and-forth with a total stranger 🤷🏻‍♂️ but I appreciate people keeping it civil on here. I just hope most people realize that one of the better ways to have fun with the team is to just sit back and learn and understand how Bob/Joe/Kirk think, rather than poke holes every day including Sunday. And I do think when one has garnered 3 champs and 5 years, some people ought to let things go, just out of respect. That’s just common courtesy in real life and I would hope this website that we are part of is more reality than the quicksand from hell that is Twitter/IG/FB. Alright, I’ve said my peace; til the next scouting report...

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3 champs *in 5 years

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Hate to throw cold water on everything, but I don't think the Warriors are even going to make use of the TPE. Aside from the fact that they would have to give up a good draft pick to get somebody that they could trade (because they don't want to trade Curry, Thompson, Green, and Wiggins), adding a player with a $17m salary puts them well into the luxury tax even before you consider that the cap figures are likely to go down, perhaps significantly. There almost certainly won't be a full 2020-2021 season, so they can't recoup it in ticket and concession sales, and I have no idea what that means for the TV deals. Lacob and Gruber are rich dudes, but they didn't get that way by taking huge risks with marginal upside.

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from hoopsrumors(outdated article pre COVID)

Golden State Warriors: $17,185,185 (expires 7/7/20): Since they’re hard-capped for the rest of the 2019/20 league year, the Warriors are extremely unlikely to make use of this exception – created in the Andre Iguodala trade – before next summer. However, when the new league year begins next July, this exception could be an interesting tool for the over-the-cap (but no longer hard-capped) Warriors to make a deal during the 2020 offseason.

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seems to me, that as long as it doesnt hard cap the warriors, that they'll likely eat a few million extra to get an impact player to add to the starting lineup. along with a top draft pick? seems like a no brainer.

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Forgive my ignorance on the matter, but isnt a TPE meant to be salary 'exempt' from a team's avail cap space? Kinda like KD's trade that turned into Dlo's contract, then flipped for Wiggins' contract?

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Exempt from the cap space but, AFAIK, they would still need to pay the luxury tax which is tied to the cap.

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10-4.

If the rumors are true about Bob targeting him, and now Lacob might take a quarter of a bill loan out from Goldman Saches, i dont think they'll shy away from adding him. Lacob has never been the shy type

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There is some information about the TPE at https://www.letsgowarriors.com/p/warriors-trade-exception-tournament

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Thank you sir.

i know im a stranger to you guys...but u guys arent to me. Been following since the summer of Iggy. U guys are top notch! Grew up just over the hill from Roaracle, so im not a new fan either

Gratz on the new site btw. I like it better

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I have been all in on Aaron Gordon for a couple of years. And I believe it was last year that he came to Draymond's skills/leadership camp. Orlando has never been able to figure out what to do with him. As I've said before, pretty sure the Warriors would have no problem figuring it out.

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Orlando has never been able to figure out anything, but I think Gordon is an overrated, underachieving, undersized PF who doesn't dominate the paint and doesn't defend the rim. Comparing him with Wiggins, as some posters do, is nuts. Wiggins is a 5 tool player already and just needs to be more aggressive in his game. I cannot see Gordon as a target for the Dubs. Finances don't work and they need more size and a real playmaker for the bench who can score. MCW is a more realistic target at his price point.

Are they going to bring back Glenn Robinson III?

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AG is undersized? Isnt he 6'9? Ive seen him play stellar defense on the perimeter. We sorely lack that.

Wiggins is aleo those things u descibe about AG. Many say hes underachieved since getting paid, and it does show in his lackadaisical nature at times, thus the inconsistency. We started to see him decline just before the shut down. He could get flipped sooner rather than later, but maybe the Dubz Brass holds onto him and likes what he will bring w the big 3. We will see.

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Listed as 6'8", but he is playing PF. Wiggins 6/7" is a SF. My knock on Wiggins is his lack of aggression. If the Warriors trade him, they must get more value than Gordon brings, imo.

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I think a SBDS lineup of Steph-Klay-Wiggins-Gordon-Draymond would be very dominant on both sides of the ball

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Neither Gordon nor Draymond are capable of guarding bigs. Lakers abused Gordon the other night. We need more size. A guy like Nerlens can protect the rim and rebound, and comes cheaply. Great energy, too.

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I'm sorry, but Draymond has demonstrated over the course of multiple seasons that he is more than capable of guarding bigs. That we don't use him to do so more often is more related to the wear and tear on Draymond than it is a pure basketball decision.

Sure, we need big bodies to bang with the Steven Adams of the NBA, but Draymond can for sure guard bigs - effectively.

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How does a Gordon trade work tho ? Can’t use the Iggy exception because Gordon’s salary is is 19 while the exception is under 18 and you can’t send any players to make the numbers work because warriors are over the cap . Can’t trade Wiggins for him because then magic would be over the cap and frankly I think I would rather just keep Wiggins at this point .... unless it’s a trade that send Draymond I don’t see how you do it and I’d rather just keep Draymond 🤷🏻‍♂️

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Trade Wiggins for Gordon? Why in the world would they do that even if the $$ worked? Wiggins is a rare player with a full set of tools who effortlessly gives them 20+ ppg, can pass, rebound, defend, and who has yet to play with the core of the team!

Draymond for Gordon? I would like to trade Draymond but Gordon is not the defender that Dray is, nor is he a rim defender like Chriss. Gordon is overrated and I don't see the Warriors making a play for him. As I said above, MCW is a more likely target as he fits a need and the financials.

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Wiggins’ passing, rebounding, and defense are mediocre at best. And his “effortless” 20 points take up many possessions than an elite player needs to score the same number of points.

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You're underrating him and you haven't even seen him perform with the core, yet. I'm not saying he is an elite player in the class of Lebron, just better Gordon and many, many, other players. the Dubs seem excited to have him.

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Dude, you’re the one who made the claim that Wiggins can pass, rebound, defend and score effortlessly; the burden is on you to support that claim, not your new claim that he’s better than “many other players” but not as good as LeBron, lol.

I’m not “rating” him — just noting the fact that over his NBA career he has done none of the things you mention at a particularly high level (4.4 reb and 2.4 ast per 36, .522 true shooting, -2.0 DBPM). Facts is facts.

Obviously, like you, I’m hoping he can improve. He’s still young and super-athletic, with (seemingly) a good head on his shoulders; and his play in the last couple years has shown improvement, particularly as a passer and defender. But you know who you can also say all those things about? Aaron Gordon. You’re trying to draw a distinction where none exists.

In any case, there’s no reason to compare them, since acquiring Gordon would not preclude keeping Wiggins. They play different positions, and Gordon’s salary would fit into Andre’s TPE (via a bridge trade), not Wiggins’ max salary slot.

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He can pass, defend, and rebound. You're the one disputing that. No comparison exists in my mind with Gordon. Two different positions, apples and oranges. It's not going to happen, what can I say?

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i think many would dispute your claim (especially with stats that Sleepy lays out here) of Wiggins being able to do those things well. seems to me that if he has been doing those things at a high level as consistently as you claim, he wouldn't be on his 3rd team before he's even 30 years old.

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I mean, Cannon Curry can pass, defend, and rebound, too. Your implication was that Wiggins does those things at a high level for an NBA player, which is not the case, at least not yet. Indeed, Gordon does all three of those things better than Wiggins.

If you’re now saying there’s no comparison between the two (after making the comparison, lol) I totally agree. As I noted, they play different positions and would not be competing for the same salary slot. Also, as RaiderX says, they could potentially be a pretty killer forward tandem.

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Yeah that’s why I said I wouldn’t do it , I agree with everything you say except for Wiggins can defend. I guess theoretically he can and should be able to but his career says other wise he’s been one of the worst defenders in the league save for a few games he played for the warriors , if he becomes an average defender that would be a great accomplishment

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He has Draymond's stamp of approval in defending.

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So did DLO I recall , what’s he going to say ?

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AG's contract is worth $18.1m...vs $17.2m TE. it works.

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Exactly they can only go 100,000 over the 17.2 Soo 18.1 does NOT work . The bridge trade i have no idea how it works . Would we send Say James Johnson plus looney?

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We would include the MIN 2021 1st rounder...that would likely bridge the gap

Dont take my word for it. Talk to the writers at the Athletic if you want to debate it, because they think its doable. Its not so black and white as u seem to think it is.

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A pick does nothing for salary cap space but it does sound like there is a way with a third team I just don’t understand it and sounds like there’s a lot of moving parts but as far as straight up using the Iggy exception it’s not possible

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NBA salary cap is indeed very confusing. I cant begin to understand it either. I mean, would have guessed Bob could allocate KD's salary as basically a giant exception just from him agreeing to a trade for Dlo, and then flip it again for Wiggins?! Crazy loop holes.

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Bridge trade. You take on someone with a 1 year deal in the 15-17M range and then flip them to Orlando. James Johnson from Minny has been mentioned.

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Plus the MIN 2021 pick. It absolutely works.

How would u feel about trading our top 5 pick for John Collins?

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The pick doesn't help with the salary. The TPE can't cover Gordon in any way, but you can trade for a salary to send to Orlando.

I'm not interested in Collins, personally. Weak defender. I don't want to trade one of our best assets for a one way player stacking stats on a bad team who's about to get a big contract. There's just lots of other options I like better. Gordon included.

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i didn't think he was a weak defender. probably kind of hard to tell on a weak ATL roster no? but yea, i suppose IF there's a reason ATL doesnt want to pay him, it would be for a reason like that. he is a gifted scorer. maybe drafting OO would be a better option because of the rookie salary and his staggering defensive abilities.

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Collins has definitely been mentioned by Warriors insiders. I plan to scout him a little bit too.

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Best case scenario this off season:

-Sam's proposal of nabbing Aaron Gordon (basically a 3 team trade)...

-Flip our top 5 pick to the Hawks for John Collins

-MLE goes to MCW

-vet min to GRIII

Health permitting, that would result in another Larry for the Dubz

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Are you sure ATL wants a 2020 top five pick though? Also how certain are you on MLE for MCW? I've been assuming he's a vet min, which he's making now, but I could be wrong. He's certainly doing stuff to help his value go up.

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Word is Hawks dont want to extend him. Im just going off of that. Ur right though, they would be a little nutz to take a mystery top 5 pick for a proven commodity. Ive also seen teams do dumber things.

Maybe they they really like Ok in the draft? Getting a comparable player on a 5 yr rookie deal is attractive to GM's.

I would assume since its NBA FA and many players tend to get slightly overpaid, MCW is a candidate for that. He has earned a few more bux. Yep his all around game has definitely blossomed, esp as a perimeter defender. He would be worth the MLE IMO. but hey, vet min would be a steal.

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I'm watching Jae Crowder right now and would totally want him with the MLE. As mentioned in the article above, scouting report on him forthcoming. The bad part about pursuing Crowder is I feel that's exactly what's needed from Paschall.

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True dat. But Crowder is an SF, not a PF, and having more than one player on the floor that gives you toughness and a 3 point shot can't be bad. I'll take it.

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Well Paschall was just a rookie tho right? ...its hard to see him not progressing. Id rather keep him and add a real wing.

Crowder is nails tho.

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Yes, add Crowder. He can team w/Paschall. Love it.

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I just realized the title(s) are wrong. AG can’t actually be signed as a FA, oops.

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Also, you listed him as 6’11” in the article. He’s not that tall.

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It's not necessarily that they're better off without him as much as it's a deeply weird roster.

In the frontcourt they have three pure C's who all play significant minutes in Vucevic, Birch, and Bamba. So they never play small, and often play two of them together. Their THIRD most used lineup this year had Vucevich, Birch, with Gordon at the 3.

They also NEVER go small with Gordon and Isaac as the 4/5. It's crazy! Imagine being 30-35, and never trying out a lineup with those two, their best shooters in Ross/Fournier and then maybe Fultz or MCW. That seems like such a fun athletic lineup. When Isaac/Gordon do play together it's always next to a traditional big, with one of them playing at 3.

You could probably get away with one of them playing a fair amount of minutes at the 3, if you had a great shooting backcourt to space the court. Fournier is a great shooter. Ross and Augustin are ok. But they play LOTS of minutes with total non-shooters Fultz or MCW at PG.

So in short, it's a roster heavy on C's and PF's, and non-shooters in the backcourt. So you're NOT insane...they are. They definitely need to do something.

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Nah, nit overblown. You're not drawing this opinion from one or two practice game...thats been the story of his whole career there thus far, like you pointed out.

Seems to me the writing is on the wall. Question becomes, what do they want for him? If Bob wants him. How does he make the monies work?

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deletedJul 25, 2020Liked by punk basketball
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I thought the general consensus/rumors were that they dont want to pay Collins?

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I've done zero research on this other than the fact that Collins only makes $4M+ so I'd find it hard to believe that's enough to make anyone go, “I don't want to pay that.” Doesn't move the needle enough in the grand scheme of things. But I could be wrong.

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Well yea, its the last year of his rookie deal. I could be wrong also. I am once again just going off of the rumors that since they took on Capellas deal, that they'll let him walk.

There's the possibility also that he will tell them he wants out of Atl. We shall see in a few months

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I think the chances of the Dubs going for Gordon are very low. They don't need him. MCW is another story.

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Finish games with AG at the 4 and Draymond at the 5.

I agree on MCW esp after watching him play two scrimmages and assuming he's at the vet min. There are far worse vet mins out there, Warriors fans have experienced some of them first-hand. I'm planning to write about MCW next.

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