Dub Nation HQ Comments of Week, plus open thread
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Dub Nation HQ Comments of Week, plus open thread
Summer League Dreams Edition
Wiseman improves D and rebounding, Kuminga…
Sum Dubs almost storm back from 23 down
Alex (15 ♡):
Does anyone else suspect that having Andre, in a year when almost half the roster is rookies and second years, might actually be important to the team developing and coming together over the season?
Compared with a year before, the communication and togetherness on the team seemed better last year, and more reminiscent of 2015-2018. The team just seemed more on the same page, both in interviews, and in every player on the roster having a clear idea of why they were on the court, game after game. Dray is communicative but definitely the bad cop at times when he's yelling at you on the court, Steph and Klay are both known for being quiet most of the time. Only Andre seems to have the style (according to interviews over the years) of constantly checking in with players, from rookies to vets, to see what's really going on with people and then using that connection to quietly say the right thing to them at the right moment on the court.
(Very hard, of course, to separate Andre's influence from changes in coaching staff, and other factors from year to year.)
Nate P (13 ♡):
Just thought others might find this interesting to help temper some of the more outrageous summer league takes: preseason is about six times more predictive of regular season play than summer league, according to Kevin Pelton’s research…even then there are a whole bunch of quite obvious confounding variables.
Just food for thought (even though my emotions will remain on this roller coaster every time I see Wiseman miss a fadeaway jumper from 2 ft away lol).
ThankyouDubs (13 ♡):
To better appreciate the performance of our highly touted lottery picks, I choose to gain perspective from our previous draft picks of the “Core”: Curry ‘09, Klay ‘11, Draymond ‘12. And compared their rise to All-Star level play.
Time from when drafted to First All-Star selection. Curry took 5 yrs. Klay took 4 years, Draymond 4 years.
College basketball experience including tournaments. Curry and Klay 3 years. Draymond 4 years.
So if I include college and NBA experience, the time it took for our brilliant “golden core” to reach All-Star selection: Curry 8 years, Klay 7 years, and Draymond 8 years.
Given that our current lottery picks were drafted so young with virtually no college experience and only 1 yr NBA, I expect the soonest any of them to reach All-Star 2026.
Jordan Poole drafted ’19 by comparison had 2 years college experience including a Finals NCAA and now 3 years NBA is on the cusp of All-Stardom. 5 years and counting.
Compared to the outliers, the GOAT level all-stars:
LeBron James had zero college basketball experience. Drafted ‘03. All-Star ‘04. A strong argument for being a G.O.A.T. as it took him only 1 year from high school to All-Star.
Michael Jordan. 3 years college experience. Drafted ‘84. All-Star ‘85. So 4 years of college and NBA until All-Star.
Conclusion I take from it—experience matters A LOT. Unless you a basketball genius like LBJ. Now, I appreciate even more the contributions of Otto Porter, Bjelica, and GP2.
Goofus (11 ♡):
I think KD’s narrative takes a much bigger hit.
“Steph didn’t need KD, but KD needed Steph.” gets set in cement.
BadlyBrowned (10 ♡):
Was always going to be too much to expect huge leaps from the guys with the non-existent offseason they've had so far. But with Wiseman, I think we've seen some little improvements compared to his rookie year.
I haven't noticed any stone hands from Wiseman so far, and his timing/anticipation on defending the PnR seems better. I feel like he's had a noticeable intimidation factor protecting the rim. Timing still a bit off on rebounds though, I feel like I can see the cogs in his head turning from "OK, box my man out" to "OK, get the rebound" when a shot goes up. Offensively still pretty raw. Would love to see him be patient to look for split cuts in the low post.
Moody looking a little more comfortable making decisions with the ball and finding others. 4 assists on the night. He'll need to learn to finish at the rim with finesse. Do whatever Klay did to figure out his layups after his first couple seasons. Hopefully doesn't take him as long as Wiggins to figure out his left hand.
As for JK, I suppose it was good that JK seemed more looking to take what the defense gave him, which meant more mid-range jumpers. Felt like not forcing the ball to the rim in a crowded paint was part of why he cut down on his TOs this game. I guess we'll see how it goes next game. I would like to see them run JK on point as much as possible, quicker decision making with the ball; knowing when to shoot or pass, is what he needs to work on, and I think that's something that you gotta do with real game experience. The 3pt and FT shooting he can do in a gym after SL is over.
Anyways, I'm fairly satisfied with the guys looking at least like what we've seen before and expect.
When preseason hits is when I want to see some fruits of development in the offseason.
Stefano Gelati (9 ♡):
I’m very happy with Wiseman emotion level in the last minutes of the game. Let’s remember that it was likely the first clutch game of his career, in which he was actually in the endgame lineup. The way he was furious for losing, bodes very well for two critical months in which he will be, hopefully, working hard in the gym and in the training court. JW, you may take your revenge against them clovers in ‘23 finals :D
vignette17 (9 ♡):
I mean from a pure Steph fanboy perspective, hard to say it's not a good career decision. Hard to argue KD > Steph with 2 more rings than him and 1 more MVP. Can't pass you in rings if he's on your team. And if you pass Lebron in rings....well, you're the ultimate winner of your generation even if not the best player. And then it just comes down to the cost. If you can get KD and keep Steph/Klay/Dray/Looney, well that's still a championship favorite for 2+ more years.
From a Warriors fan perspective, I did not enjoy rooting for the Steph-KD team in year 3. At least not nearly as much as I enjoyed every other contending year. In a perfect world, I want to beat KD one more time in the playoffs. And I love Jordan Poole, Wiggins, and Moody. So for non-basketball reasons, I'd be out. Same with LBJ for the minimum in a year or two.
Run_TMC (9 ♡):
So I enjoy watching summer league to see how our guys are doing, but I don't put much stock in it with regards to JW, JK, MM. We know they are on the team and will have all season to develop so even if they looked terrible (which they don't, just saying if) in summer league, there's no real affect.
I am also interested in what I can see about marginal/possible players, so here's my take so far on guys:
Quiñones: I am in agreement with the general consensus in that I have not seen anything to warrant even a 2-way. It's not just his shooting which was supposed to be his strength. I mean it's a kind of small sample size, but I wonder what Warriors brass is thinking.
Weatherspoon: There is a Slater article in the Athletic (paywalled, but someone posted excerpts on r/warriors) that says that the Warriors basically want him back on a 2-way and that feels right to me. I just can not get a handle on if he kind of is what he is or would do better as a role player/d specialist in a real system with better players. Sometimes I have really liked what I saw and sometimes I think he's just another pretty talented guy who is missing that little something extra to make a regular NBA roster.
McClung: The same Slater article says Warriors do not plan on signing him. I agree. His athleticism is pretty amazing, but I read an article/interview with GP2 where he said pretty early out of college he realized he was going to need a special skill and started focusing on defense with an emphasis on disturbing the opponent dribble/stealing the ball. As we know he got really good at it. Also while McClung supposedly jumps higher than GP2, it doesn't feel like it at all. GP2 must just be quiker or more effortless or something. McClung just seems to fall short of an NBA player but I expect he would do well in whatever overseas league he chose to play in.
Santos: Like everyone, I was very pleasantly surprised by this late 2nd round pick. I basically discounted his first California Classic game and wanted to see what he looked like over a larger sample size. It really feels like he is on track to be an NBA player. Good passing feel and willing. Moves at his own pace and pretty good finisher. Good effort and pretty good ability on D. The way things seem to be breaking, it doesn't look like he will even get a 2-way so I hope that the warriors find the past path to his quick development whether that's back at Minas in Brasil or in Santa Cruz (if he can buy out his Minas contract) and I will hope his progression is such that he is in real contention for a spot in the 23-24 season.
Jessup - I bought in to the hype on emperor Justinian right up until I saw him play in summer league last year. And though he has clearly improved this year and is a smart player who works hard and knows how to play (e.g. moves feet and doesn't reach on D) he just doesn't have the physical tools to be an NBA player.
Everyone else: Nope. The guys they brought in that people thought might do something like Chachashvili, Uthoff, etc just haven't shown anything. The one dark horse guy I have kinda liked and I hope they try to sign to Santa Cruz is Sleva. Very small glimpses, but he's done a couple things I liked. Would like to see him in a more structured environment with a little more opportunity, maybe.
Sleepy Freud (8 ♡):
Ric Bucher is always 100% full of 💩
mDuo13 (8 ♡):
I invite you to look at Andre's stats for last season again. In the regular season minutes he did play, was sneaky good.
Best raw per-minute +/- of anyone on the team except Dowtin (whose per-minute numbers are waaaay less meaningful because he played far fewer minutes). Third-best AST%, after Green and Curry; second-best AST/36 after Dray. Third-best STL%, after GPII and Draymond, 5th-best STL/36, after GPII, Otto, Dray, and JTA. More rebounds/36 than about half the team (including Wiggins!). Second highest BLK/36, after Draymond. Way down at 8th in TOV/36. Fewest personal fouls/36. And yeah, he didn't really score, but he still got more points/36 than Chiozza.
With an end-of-the-bench type of roster slot, having quality over quantity minutes is a valid and honestly high-value way to spend that money. If Iguodala contributes even half the minutes he did this past regular season, that's a significant on-court boost. His magic hands can still play quality defense *and* throw some highlight passes to the young guys, who are better finishers than facilitators at this point in time. Even if you totally discount his leadership and other intangibles, Iguodala would be a luxury to have back.
crusty quips (8 ♡):
I didn't learn much from SL because I don't believe it is instructive whatsoever in terms of predicting how a player will play during the actual NBA season in real games, much less their ability to perform in high-leverage moments like the playoffs. Every year players show out in summer league that will never see a big league roster and, conversely, players that will later become major contributors in the NBA seem ordinary or discombobulated. Sure it's nice to see a promising young player flash some new skills but overall I don't think SL gives us much useful info in a predictive context of a player's potential or career trajectory.
The one thing I gleaned from watching the last few games is that JW is finally able to play in multiple games over the course of a few days and suffer no physical setbacks, which makes me very enthusiastic about his upcoming progress this season. Hope he uses the rest of the off-season to continue his physical as well as his skills training. If he can stay healthy all season, he will be productive for the Dubs.
The return of James Wiseman, plus Kuminga…
Not bad, it was just Summer League, but you can see the promise
Goldarn Staid Worrier (20 ♡):
Other than the Wiseman debut (which I loved), the most interesting thing about the game was Kuminga’s play. Not just the points, hustle, passing, or (so very many) clanks, but the handle. Basically he played PG when he was on the court, and that forced him to be engaged at every moment on offense, practice dribbling, reads, play calling, passing, etc. Pretty genius bit of coaching for the kid - make him play a position that he almost never will in the regular season. Engage his mind, challenge him, wake him up to how structured offense starts and stops, decision making, handle, plays. And also give the coaches massive amounts of info about his skills. A few games like this create a season’s worth of teachable (and recorded, so viewable) moments. Such great stuff. This is what SL should be about - low stress education.
Eric Apricot (15 ♡):
I think Wiseman is going to mostly play drop coverage of pick and roll, so it is very good for him to improve on that. He'll have plenty of practice communicating and being the back line captain of the D. If he gets good at the D, he can stay on the court enough to warrant learning the zones and switching.
To practice switching D they would have to get everyone on the team on the same page (not just Wiseman) which I think is impossible in the short time of G-League.
Goofus (13 ♡):
Take a moment to stew on these wingspans numbers:
Poole 6’7”
Moody 7’1”
Kuminga 6’11”
Baldwin 7’2”
Wiseman 7’6”
The projected future lineup of the five most recent first rounders AVERAGES over 7 feet! Are there any current teams who can claim that kind of length in their starting lineup?
Oh, and if you sub in Rollins (6’10”) for Poole and/or Santos (7’) for Kuminga, they get even longer. Also, Wiggins and 7’ and Looney at 7’4” just add to the ridiculous length.
crusty quips (13 ♡):
#lengthinnumbers
Sleepy Freud (12 ♡):
[Kuminga’s] D on Primo was spectacular, I thought. Primo’s been getting a good deal of hype lately, and he had nothing for JK.
Kenny Nonymous (11 ♡):
Seeing Wise out there, doing what he does with a basketball, was so much fun to watch, and I am extremely happy for him and the Warriors. Here's to his continued health. JK is always fun to watch, but I am a believer in Mac, and wouldn't mind him on the bench one iota next season. After watching Moody go off the other day, summer league notwithstanding, it's nice to see the youngsters find their footing.
Five Alarm Freddy (11 ♡):
I went to a luncheon with Rick Barry at the 2018 All Star Game. I asked for a picture with him and my 6 year old daughter. Like a good grandpa he happily picked her up in his arms and I took the picture. He then walked off with my daughter and continued his conversations with other people. She was sucking on her fingers and twirling his hair with her other hand. They both were very, very happy. I was just standing there in a convention hall wondering if I was ever going to get my daughter back...
Summer League 5. 4:30pm. GSW v SAS. Wiseman’s…
So many new undead Spurs
DFiB (14 ♡):
It’s happening!!! So happy for James to be able to start figuring out this whole NBA thing for real.
jzalvarado (13 ♡):
Mcclung & Wiseman sounds like a Law Firm
Goofus (9 ♡):
If it takes a 12th finals appearance for Steph to get another FMVP, so be it.
Goofus (9 ♡):
Don’t give a shit about the score. Do give a shit about (in order) the great things we’ve seen from Wiseman, that Kuminga is still a stud even if he’s a little rusty and how much fun Mac and Gui are.
AttilaTheHun (9 ♡):
I thought y'all might like to know that although we're still running on generators on Wiseman Island for now, the lights will be on this evening, and the bar is open. We are told that the main power (clean renewable energy of course) will be fully operational by training camp. If you aren't already here, come on down, enjoy the views, and join the party!
Nate P (9 ♡):
I’m in!
An island dive bar running on generators is a VIIIIIBE …
GhostRidingTheInjuryCart (9 ♡):
Absolutely, he's going to be very rusty, just get out and play hard (but avoid excessive contact).
My expectations tonight:
Wiseman enters: Yay! He's on the court! You've done the hard part, Wiseman, now reap the rewards of your rehab!
Misses shot: Was it a long 3 or a long 2? If not, good job, good effort!
Makes a shot: Okay, 20 pt double-double incoming!
Dunk or Block: Move over Looney! I expect nothing less than a Hall of Fame career from James!
BadlyBrowned (8 ♡):
I'm just no sure how much we're supposed to expect improvements from the young guys when they've had no offseason yet.
For JK and Moody, I think SL is about putting the ball in their hands and get them making decisions with the ball, since it's something they won't get often with the big club.
For Wiseman, just let him play and gain confidence in the knee again.
Once they come back for training camp, I'll start judging the basketball.
UneasySquirrel (7 ♡):
Positive trend for Kuminga, including his otherwise-desultory first SL game, that I've noticed is he's been pretty solid about boxing out/finding somebody to put a body on when a shot goes up.
Also, I absolutely fucking loved his dribble penetration and dish to Wiseman in the 4th quarter. Properly keeping a trailing defender on your hip/back and keeping the handle tight is one of my favorite plays in basketball when done right, and he did it perfectly at 6'8". Then a great dish (and great hands by Wiseman, it was a good pass but with some velocity from maybe 10 feet away, so not an easy catch). And to top it off, Wiseman didn't bring the ball down and gather unnecessarily, just went straight up for the quick dunk.
Warriors Mythbusters Part II: Trophies over…
Winning isn't everything. IT'S THE ONLY THING!
FromMunichWithLove (20 ♡):
I still am absolutely no BB expert, still have trouble seeing the difference between an offensive foul and a block (but so seem the refs quite often…) so call me a casual if you want. But from the first time I saw the Warriors play (tv), I was hooked. The ball movement, the flow, like a well choreographed dance. Nothing against a nice dunk from time to time though (Wiggs!). I am still so happy about this last ring. Betting with my son (Bulls fan) at the beginning of the season that they will win it all. So I was right. Never in doubt. 😁
ThankyouDubs (18 ♡):
During the seasons when Warriors became a lottery pick team, so many coworkers told me (most of them laker fans) the same regurgitated sports pundit spew that “Curry will never win again!” So, being a mild-mannered Dub fan, I took this opportunity to bet said coworkers (I managed to get a 10 to 1 odds from one lol). Thanks to the penances of these disbelievers, I am now a new subscriber! Thank you Mr. Apricot for your amazing insights and entertaining commentary on Explain One Play. Also, props to the gang on DNHQ’s Youtube vidcast who brought me here for more—good vibes, good insight! Let the champagne (or is that “shame-pain”) flow!
Captain Jack (16 ♡):
Thank god ours aren't playing because they're already injured!
Goldarn Staid Worrier (16 ♡):
Major news, but I’ve been on this board a few years now and am ready to pull back the cloak of privacy called “Richard” and reveal my true name. Don’t abuse this trust, friends.
Alex (16 ♡):
If someone says 'In order for your team to win a championship, Player X will need to score 40', and Player X is an all-time great offensive player who can create his own shot with elite shooting ability, whoops, not elite, I meant Best In The History Of The Planet, playing in a system that is tailored to and centered around him, I find a nice comfy spot to watch a parade from.
Sabrina-"Holy Cannoli." (15 ♡):
"And I think we’re all glad they took a chance on Gary Payton II."
I hereby declare him to be called WARRIORS LEGEND Gary Payton II.
Five Alarm Freddy (13 ♡):
Light years!
Canela (13 ♡):
I don't know spit from Shinola, and I admit it. It's refreshing to have something in my life where I do not have to be an expert and nothing depends on my getting anything right. But it's fun to follow the opinions of others while I remain an uncritical homer/ adoring fan. So thanks for providing some fun and info; I kinda love you all though not nearly as much as Eric A does.
Sleepy Freud (11 ♡):
I think it’s a pretty good comp. Slight edge Ray right now, but I think Klay might be close to tying him around now if he hadn’t lost 2.5 seasons of his absolute peak to catastrophic injuries. Sigh.
One nice thing about the Ray comp, if it holds: Ray’s best stretch of his career was the age 32-35 seasons that Klay is right about to enter.
jenny holland (10 ♡):
the thing is that i remember taking those comments and predictions to heart - at the time - and being so overjoyed to see the Dubs playing the way they did in the postseason. it's impossible to predict with accuracy how brilliant steph is going to be, when draymond starts embracing the match-up, when andrew finds his hops and rebounds like a hound, how gary payton II (i'm still in mourning, btw) finds a way to strip the ball out of elite hands, and klay - you just had to love the return of the athletic klay....not to take away from anyone else, but for me, those elements all came together at the end of the playoffs, faster and faster, with more and more coherence. and, watching the dubs then, i knew we were going to win, but i didn't think that in the middle of the season.
Asher B. (10 ♡):
Finders Guipers, is my motto.
Joe Viray (10 ♡):
That Jim Park tweet is WILD.
(So was mine, tbh lmao)
Captain Jack (9 ♡):
Random late Saturday night comment but damn it Im so excited to see Wiseman out there with the Splash Bros next year. As huge as Bogut was for our culture and defense they (Steph,Klay and Dray) has never had a big man as talented as Wise. Id love to see him come back from this injury stronger than ever and turn some heads. He’s definitely capable.
Oaktownws (9 ♡):
Maybe I should be making more dramatic emotional hot takes to make it into one of these articles…
I’m realy wnjoying this myth busters series! More please!
I loved this especialy:
Dr. Tom: I’m not even going to address how aggressively stupid saying Kerr is “like an extreme leftist” when talking about a basketball coach and a game plan. It’s almost impressive how dense that is.
Hahhahahahahha
Goldarn Staid Worrier (8 ♡):
It is pretty amazing how high the standard of commentary is here. Many here are far greater experts than many public figures. And Eric, DDD, and Daniel are exalted epic exemplars of truth beauty and the Dubmerican way.
Yes, there are some DNHQ desperados who limbo their way under a very low standard of commentary indeed, but why name names when we are all still reveling in victory and full of love and good cheer?
Summer League 4. 5:00pm. GSW v NYK.
VIVA LAS VEGAS
Trogdor (17 ♡):
Another reason for Lacob's "$400m payroll is too much!" comments. New CBA talks are supposed to be starting like right now. What is the ONE thing that the Warriors want? Tax relief! Not just in the short term, but moving forward.
What happens if Lacob waltzes in there and says "I just spent a record amount of money and we won a championship! We've won 4 in the past 8 years, btw, in case any of you forgot. Oh, and have you seen our young talent? Wiggins, Poole, Kuminga, Wiseman, Moody! We're gonna be winning chips into the next decade, baby! Our cash flow is so good from all of our revenue streams that we laugh in the face of your puny luxury tax! Gold-blooded for life!"
Yeah, the other owners will push for laying down a solid hammer on lux tax spending in the next agreement. If Lacob says the right things and plays nice with the other owners then we *might* have a better chance of keeping our key guys moving forward and continuing our winning ways.
belilaugh (16 ♡):
> Moody, along with the recently signed Donte DiVincenzo, will step into Payton’s vacated role and see their perimeter defense tested. One of Moody’s pre-draft concerns was lateral quickness. He can move a bit slowly when sliding side-to-side on the perimeter. But a strength program has unlocked some speed.
https://theathletic.com/3405248/2022/07/08/moses-moody-interview-warriors-summer-league/
Article by Slater on Moody, wanted to highlight the last sentence though and how relevant it is to Baldwin. I am guessing that UW Milwaukee's strength and conditioning program pales in comparison to even Arkansas' program, let alone an NBA program. This article points out that Moody is now quicker and jumps better off of one or two feet, we saw it with Poole and his speed as well, and if Baldwin can get healthy I think a year with the Warriors could do him a ton of good too.
TwoRingTest (13 ♡):
Personally, all I'm hoping for is no sore knee the next day. Anything he actually does on the court is gravy.
crusty quips (13 ♡):
Full version of Point Forward podcast with Wiggins dropped today, worth a half an hour of your time. Wiggs opens up more than he usually does.
dinohealth (12 ♡):
Good night to ALL...great to see some old reliable bball sages in here...STILL the BEST FORUM for TRUE DUB FANS...We gonna keep getting them ''Shampionships''...
crusty quips (12 ♡):
Just listened to more of that TK interview with Joe Lacob. I feel like it was weird for some of the folks on Warriors reddit that called out his comments about a $400-$500m roster being unrealistic to not also mention that he said he wants to beat Jerry Buss' record of 10 NBA titles and 16 Finals appearances. Doesn't sound like a guy who is about to start cheaping out on championship contention.
Sleepy Freud (12 ♡):
I didn’t say he could predict the future, I just said he was “great.”
Part of his greatness is that he understands the CBA and the Warriors’ specific cap situation better than anyone on this site (if still imperfectly).
Another part imho is that he’s a smart and fun dude who has perspective in life and openly appreciates the great joy the Warriors have given us in the Kerr era, rather than endlessly stressing out about worst possible outcomes and being miserable all the time. It’s basically the spirit of the Gold Blooded King that infuses this site, as opposed to the spirit of the miserable concern trolls in places like Twitter and Reddit.
Anyone who’s unhappy and stressed out about the current state of the Warriors is always gonna be stressed out and unhappy, cos this is as good as it gets, sports fandom-wise. 😊
jzalvarado (11 ♡):
Yo not gonna lie. My parents are from Mexico. Lucked out on being conceived and born in the United States. I have zero clue what people should refer to my ethnicity as..ill take Chicano, Hispanic, Latino, Mexican American, Latin-X, the whole shebang but I still try and get educated by my fellow kinfolk on why the term I'm labeling myself or being labeled as is incorrect and its been every term at any given moment lol
Captain Jack (10 ♡):
600+ comments on a summer league game thread for a team that just won the NBA championship... world class community right here
Dan goutz (10 ♡):
Not me. I know im in the minority, but I've enjoyed these 4 games despite the fact they were blowouts. Santos is interesting, and moody just scored 30+! Plus Kuminga is always fun to watch even though he struggled tonight
Goofus (10 ♡):
Warriors just published a “Welcome” highlight vid of DDV. I’m telling y’all, with his offense he’s a net upgrade over GP2.
Warriors Mythbusters Part I: The doubts GSW…
You are forgiven if you believed any of these narratives.
Daniel Hardee (20 ♡):
I am so proud of the comments on this thread. Clearly I am surrounded by dynastic championship level commenters
Goofus (17 ♡):
“You’re hurt?! That’s great! I mean, get well soon and everything, but I was worried that you just sucked.”
ThankyouDubs (16 ♡):
After my dad passed away in 2017, I wrote a letter to Stephen Curry thanking him and the dubs for helping my mom grieve. I told Mr Curry you would win (KD or no KD) at least 7 Finals. No team should scares us after the Dubs domination of the Cavs, a heated Finals rivalry that includes a freak’n G.O.A.T.! (Speaking of freaks, only the Bucks had me a little worried because of Giannis and Wiseman was still out). Seriously, they now got four rings on their hands—why. is. any. dub fan quivering?
DFiB (15 ♡):
1. The idea that the Warriors FO got lucky is hilarious to me and reads more like "THEY DIDNT LISTEN TO ME I THOUGHT IT WOULDNT WORK AT ALL AND IT WORKED ANYWAYS THEY SUCK AND I HATE THEM!!! WHAT DO YOU MEAN TURN OFF THE CAPS LOCK?"
2. I think the team sold the stars on the idea that, while we may not be at full force this year, keeping and growing the youngsters will extend the window a year or two to make up for it... AND THEN THEY @#@^ING WON ANYWAYS CUZ THATS HOW WE DO!
3. Klay has always been streaky and regularly had those 5/18 klunkers... people just forgot about it and then every one fit into their preconceived idea that "he's not gonna be really ready this year", straight confirmation bias there.
DFiB (14 ♡):
First time I noticed the new logo! Love it!
GhostRidingTheInjuryCart (14 ♡):
Loon Gehrig was one thing most people did not see coming. Huge credit to Kevon and the trainers.
Sabrina-"Holy Cannoli." (14 ♡):
I'm not going to worry about Klay until opponents start leaving him open. And they never, ever will.
ndubs (13 ♡):
“You gotta figure out different ways to get [the ball], so let me try and get my feet wet, go in there and rebound the ball,” Wiggins said of his playoff mindset. “And especially when we played small in the Memphis series and I had to rebound, I’m in there rebounding and I’m like, ‘This ain’t that hard! I can rebound!’ And from there I just kept with it. It helps us win, gives us more possessions, and I’m like, ‘I can do this.’ I’ll never average four rebounds again. I look back now like, ‘How?’ I wasn’t really thinking straight. I look back now, I don’t know how that was possible.” 4 hours ago – via Jack Winter @ Clutch Points. Is this for real?
mDuo13 (13 ♡):
Yeah check Klay's postseason defense. He was a stud and in no way did he look washed.
To answer your question, here's my take: postseason games are precious; regular season games are a grab bag. You can win a lot of regular season games just by coming in with energy, having guys who are a surprise, or by starting off with a bang and getting the other team to resign themselves to, "We'll get them next time." You can hide a lot of weaknesses in the regular season because the other team doesn't have time to study up for every player of every opponent, trades and mid-season signings included, and you can't react to a loss by planning your next game immediately. (FWIW, this is one of the reasons I liked the "baseball series" style scheduling during the '21 season.)
In the playoffs, everyone brings it to the best of their ability; you mostly don't get the chance to win one by being locked in while the other team is thinking about their next matchup or whatever. And series planning, making adjustments, is its own skill—both for players and coaching staff—but even moreso, it means incomplete players get played off the floor. Can't score driving left? Guess which direction the defense is gonna funnel you every time. Too scrawny or too slow up hold up on a switch? You've got a target on your back now. Double teams get you flustered? Welcome to the Shining; we hope you like turnovers.
Teams that have been to the playoffs know this, deep down, they're expecting it and planning for it all along. They're acquiring guys who have these tools, and training them to scram switch, or pass out of doubles, or add counter-moves, counter-counter moves, anything to avoid being shut down like that.
Also: all this is a fuckton of work. It's a rare mindset that's excited to exert a ton of effort, much of it boring, to achieve that moment of glory. Some guys, it's just not worth it to them. Like Harden? Ultimately maybe he likes basketball a little less—grinding out practice stuff is not enough fun, the reward of being a winner means less to him then just being good enough to have money, whatever. Basketball is just a job, and a game, and some guys are in a different place when it comes to the sacrifices that are worth it to them.
Mindset matters too. Some guys, it's not good enough to win, they have to be the star, it has to be their win, and that gets in the way of it too. Maybe for a select few guys that works but it's way more sustainable with a team-first mindset.
Also, luck, physical ability, etc. The usual.
Captain Jack (13 ♡):
I knew the Suns were destined to Chris Paul it up the moment they started working out postgame in the hallway after winning a regular season game
hammystyle (12 ♡):
In any endeavor there’s strategy and execution. Strategy is important and can be debated, but execution is generally vastly more important.
I’d say the Warriors generally have good strategy, and last year was very good. Their execution was unbelievable at every level of the org. Everything they got “lucky” on was a joint effort of people working extremely hard to make that plan work.
I think there’s an unfortunately large number of Warriors twitter influencers who don’t really get that concept and are fixated on what they perceive is the optimal strategy. Seems to me their ego’s get in the way of appreciating how good Warriors management and coaching is. IMO, it makes them very hard to take seriously if they can’t get that basic concept.
Goofus (12 ♡):
While I was a proponent of staying the course and believed in them ever since the 15-5 finish in the previous season, I’ll freely admit that I thought Klay was forcing way too many shots and thought his adjustment to game speed/situations would have been better served coming off the bench. If Steph wasn’t too proud to come off the bench when returning from injury, I have no idea why thinking Klay should is such blasphemy.
crusty quips (12 ♡):
I've been waiting a while for this one and it is even sweeter for having waited. I can already tell Part II will be epic.
Keep dunking on them unbelievers Daniel. Show no mercy to the faithless. To those who scoff all year at the thought that our Champs are still made of Championship stuff and that they will absolutely win again, who call us homers because we trust in the mettle and heart of our hall of fame core, to those who doubt the brilliance of Myers and Kerr, I have nothing but scorn and disdain. Put em on blast. Kiss the rings, biatches.
Searching for silver linings is what you do…
The Warriors summer league squad didn't look especially great in a blowout loss to the Heat in their final game of the California Classic. Thankfully, these games don't actually mean anything.
void (24 ♡):
"when I get eliminated watch me pout"
Sabrina-"Holy Cannoli." (12 ♡):
I guess it's true. OPJ has a wife and she's from Toronto.
“I played against Toronto a lot being in Washington D.C. [with the Wizards]. Love the city,” Porter said. “My wife is from here. It just makes sense.”
belilaugh (12 ♡):
Slater/Mahlelala mention Kuminga needing to get his conditioning back?
Turns out these guys don't immediately start training for Summer League right after winning a championship and actually take some time off to enjoy the championship? Well now, that's just unprofessional.
Abaddon (12 ♡):
Kangz momentarily excited before realizing they got the wrong Barnes.
Hashemite Kingdom (12 ♡):
The only silver lining I see is that Nate P. is writing for DNHQ now.
Good to have you here, Nate.
GhostRidingTheInjuryCart (11 ♡):
Anthony Slater
@anthonyVslater
The Warriors are promoting assistant coach Jama Mahlalela to the front of the bench, per sources. He fills the Mike Brown vacancy. Kenny Atkinson bumped to lead assistant on Steve Kerr’s staff. Mahlalela was hired last summer. He runs the player development program.
8:50 AM · Jul 7, 2022
Edit: The front office was one of the most important priorities this off-season. Not surprised it was done so quickly and efficiently after Atkinson recommitted, but still good to clear up early.
Summer League 3. 12:00pm. GSW v MIA. Gui…
The new guys!
void (21 ♡):
Man, not to be a bummer, but the more I sit with it the more I hate losing GP2. That dude was just something special. The *constant* effort, the *elite* steal percentage, the obscene true shooting percentage... and he never got rattled, even in the finals, he looked just entirely composed, same old Gary.
Somehow he managed to even turn it up a notch in the playoffs shooting 724/533/667 (yes, he shot a better percentage on 2pt attempts than free throws) on a 75% true shooting percentage... 3.7 steals+blocks in the playoffs. Crazy stats.
Dude was a cheat code... gonna miss him big time.
DFiB (11 ♡):
How did it go? Did you finish working on it yet?
Sleepy Freud (11 ♡):
The first five words of that tweet never get old. 😊
Being (11 ♡):
I think everyone is really underestimating how much improvement JW, JK, and MM will have by the playoffs next year. That's almost 10 months away. JK and MM were lightyears better in the playoffs than they were at the beginning of the reg season, and they will make a similar if not greater leap by the end of their second year. In the playoffs, GP2, OPJ, and Bjeli each played critical roles. If DDV can step up and reproduce most of what GP2 did, then I think the kids' improvement will more than offset what the Dubs will lose from OPJ and Bjeli. Add in the fact that JP and Klay will also be taking a step forward, and I think the team will be better next playoffs than they were this year.
belilaugh (10 ♡):
Imo, people are focused on the wrong players. Klay's physical development is a lot more significant than how the kids develop. If Klay gets more of his old quickness back, it elevates the team in a way that these bench guys cannot barring like a superstar trajectory or something.
Dan goutz (9 ♡):
Kuminga, Moody, and Wise are gonna make DNHQers forget all about OPJ, Bjeli, and GP2... well maybe not GP2 😢, but I bet Dontes inferno will more than make up for a lack of Gary with his play-connector approach to the game and his legit 3 ball. Not to mention his hounddog-like defense. Medium take, but I guarantee DDV will play and average more minutes than GP2 did with us. He'll also fit very well with Poole.
This team is gonna be so much better
TheseGuysAreF’ingGIANTS! (8 ♡):
Whelp, early on in that heat game I noticed Moody driving to the paint to set up the 3 pt shot. Same play twice:
1st time: he passes to the three point line but the perimeter guy stands in his spot and doesn’t move into the passing lane just like some of Draymond’s turnovers with the band of idiots a couple years ago. And the announcers say Moody might have been out of control.
2nd time: Santos slides to where the pass has to go and gets the open three.
Playing with players that understand basketball leads to better habits and outcomes.
Putting Moses Moody's California Classic…
Lester Quiñones was the standout for Game 2 as Moses Moody and Gui Santos worked on different aspects of their game.
TwoRingTest (16 ♡):
Is it wrong of me to hope that Kyrie gets traded to Miami?
I'd love to see what Jimmy Butler would do the first time Kyrie tried to burn sage on the court. Plus, Spoelstra's disgusted look is top 3 among NBA coaches.
Chasing Rings... (14 ♡):
Just a reminder, we got to see a Finals MVP performance from Steph Curry a couple of weeks ago.
Goofus (13 ♡):
I came into this draft with pretty low expectations given GSW having less-than-exciting draft position. I was fine with it since we’d kinda flukes our way into 3 lottery picks in the previous two years and hit the lottery with Poole. We were champs again (fuck yeah 🤙🏼) and I figured the days of adding to the young core were over, but I’m feeling pretty good about this draft haul. It’s not hard to imagine all three guys playing well above their respective draft slot.
Poole-Moody-Wiggins-Kuminga-Wiseman-PBJ-Rollins-Looney-Santos-DDV is a super intriguing group of young players. It’s a nice blend of both bonafide NBA players who are still improving and young guys with mind-boggling potential. There’s also a blend of of length, BBIQ and athleticism. Watching these guys develop as our core inevitably ages will be fascinating.
Death to Homers (7 ♡):
More than a few people were upset with Poole's early experimentations - complaining about 3pt pull-ups, bottle rocket drives to the rim, complex crossover step-backs, and herky-jerk hesitation moves. Poole wasn't always executing during these early days, but his experimentations have since yielded fruit.
Not to say that Moody is the same kind of fruit as Poole, but it's good to see him expand his game, struggle while doing so, and work through failure. Moody looked like he was playing rugby out there - just putting his head down and seeking contact. But it's a progression from his hesitant and opportunistic tendencies last season.
Something else about fruit..
The Sword Of The Morning (6 ♡):
It's obviously a bit more amplified on a single team fan site, but overall there is a huge positive bias when it comes to the draft in general.
IIRC, even lottery picks have a 50% chance of not getting a second contract. The downside is almost always bigger than people imagine. Even for great prospects. I remember people saying Cade's (who I think is a great prospect) floor was Khris Middleton. Middleton is an all-star! Basically 3-5 prospects in the last 25 years have an all-star floor, if that many.
Edit: This is a good piece to read on overall draft outcomes in a fairly large sample - https://theathletic.com/2736596/2021/07/29/nba-draft-is-exciting-time-for-fans-and-teams-alike-unless-youre-reading-this-partnow/
Nate P (6 ♡):
“Poole-Moody-Wiggins-Kuminga-Wiseman-PBJ-Rollins-Looney-Santos-DDV”
This is what I’ve been trying to impress upon people who are perpetually disappointed by what the front office is doing — we have a pretty good idea of what we have in Poole-Wiggins- Looney to add to the core three. So if even 3-4 of those remaining players pan out the way we all imagine they could, we’re in a very good spot.
I just don’t think we need to keep pining for another star to maintain success — just being patient with the talent we have should be good for now 🤷🏾♂️
belilaugh (5 ♡):
> It’s not hard to imagine all three guys playing well above their respective draft slot.
There's a standard post-draft optimism that usually settles in, which kinda has to be the case here since we haven't even seen Baldwin or Rollins play since the draft. Most people here went from decrying the Baldwin pick to liking it within a day or two, I'm pretty sure I was the only person who voted for him in the draft tourney. We did the same for Nedovic, Bell, McCaw, etc. We did it for Poole too although he ended up working out. Admittedly, we didn't do it much for Jacob Evans.
It is pretty unlikely that either Rollins or Santos does anything in the NBA given their draft position. I can definitely imagine it but to expect it is to expect the Warriors to beat the odds twice in the same draft. This is the same FO who drafted Paschall and Smailagic in the second round (with higher picks than either Rollins or Santos) and neither of those guys look like they will make NBA careers happen.
g8tgod (5 ♡):
Thanks for this breakdown. It's a reminder to me that I don't /really/ know what I'm looking at. It's obvious when a guy is beating his man, scoring, or harassing someone on defense. But the context is helpful. I didn't really know how these games were being utilized in player development, and it makes all kinds of sense.
Kudos to Nate and the others who contributed their insightful observations.
Dub Nation HQ Comments of Week, plus open…
Free Agency Edition
crusty quips (19 ♡):
This is the key thing, here. Our ownership group has shattered the record for spending not just for the NBA, but across ALL north american sports, and look to be set to continue to do so, yet some fans will still call them cheap. Even for someone who is labor-oriented and not a fan of owners in general like myself, this is nuts. You grade people against their peers and contemporaries and Lacob is a better owner than any of his, including the far more wealthy ones.
DFiB (14 ♡):
And I don’t even fault ownership that much. They just set a spending record, are going to set one again this year, and signs point to them doing it again next year. What more could you ask for from an ownership group then to set spending records to keep the most critical players together?
Sleepy Freud (13 ♡):
Assuming the failing grade is based almost entirely on the departures of Payton and Porter: shouldn’t that F be on Lacob and the ownership group? Obviously Myers would have matched or exceeded their contract offers if Lacob had given him carte blanche to do so.
I give Myers (and staff) an A so far, since they had basically nothing to do with the departures of Payton and Porter, and everything to do with the arrivals of Baldwin, Rollins, Santos and DiVincenzo.
Alas Phood Fight (11 ♡):
Has everyone considered what the next 4 year's of sports media would be like if Durant returned? I mean really considered it? We all love basketball. We all consume our fair share of content. If Durant joins the Warriors again, just imagine yourself strapped to a chair with your eyes taped open, ala Roddy McDowell in A Clockwork Orange, and being forced to watch 50 Shades of Gray over and over again for the next 4 years.
I'll pass.
Trogdor (11 ♡):
Happy 6 year anniversary of Durant announcing his decision to come to the Warriors!
Wow, it's pretty incredible to look back and see everything that has happened both with the Warriors and with the world as a whole since that date, including 3 championship rings. Whatever the next 6 years brings, if it's an additional 3 championship rings to the Warriors over that stretch I'll be a happy man.
GlueAndBold (9 ♡):
We really can’t be taking this ownership for granted. They do what it takes.
Hashemite Kingdom (8 ♡):
While I would also prefer that Lacob and Gruber spend themselves into oblivion, it's just not a realistic expectation. And the team is going to be looking for bargains for many years to come as our younger players grow up. So get used to this kind of offseason, unless there's a radical restructuring of NBA CBA in 2025.
I mean, if they had paid GP2 $9 million to match Portland's offer, it would have cost them something like $63 million with luxury tax included. I love the guy, incredible talent, great story, but he's the 3rd or 4th guard in the rotation (depending on where you put Klay, guard or wing). Still hate losing him, though.
I'm thankful that the owner's not someone like John Fisher or Chris Cohan - then we wouldn't be having these discussions, because we would have already traded away all our great players, or they would have left in free agency because the team ownership wouldn't pay them.
crusty quips (8 ♡):
People here were giving Bob an F last year too a day or two into free agency, especially before they signed Porter and Bjelly. Seemed to work out just fine. And that was in an off-season where a huge potential trade wasn't holding up the FA process for everyone else.
Alas Phood Fight (7 ♡):
If I am the Nets, I telling Kyrie, KD & Simmons that they are all under contract to play and are all expected to play this year. If a trade for anyone actually materializes during the year, the front office will text the traded player and gladly call them a cab. But seriously, the problem we have here is KD asking to be traded and catching the entire league off guard. It takes time, years sometimes, to maneuver your roster into a position that would allow you to trade for someone like KD. "Ok, so now you want to go on the camping trip after all the seats have been taken?" It's hard to get me to respect Harden, but his stock is going up in my book. I'll take the honest & blatant fat suit "I'm out," over the self-centered cryptic tweets about blaming everyone else for your decision.
LBJ made a lot of enemies with his Decision. But the guy returned to Cleveland and got a ring and it made for a good redemption story. Say what you want to say about LAL, they won a title. That's 3 titles, 3 teams. KD ain't getting any younger and his career could turn into one of the NBA's biggest "What could have beens?" depending on where he ends up.
Good luck KD. You gave us your Achilles tendon, and I will always respect you for that. But please, please, please, don't deprive us NBA fans of a full Nets season with KD, Kyrie and Ben Simmons. Please, don't take away this potential high speed train wreck.
PGBreaker (7 ♡):
I made your list twice. Wow. [polishes nails on shirt]
Dub Nation HQ Comments of Week, plus open thread
I am here for all this smoke
https://twitter.com/pelicansnba/status/1547655794094575616?s=21&t=ki7ylSuYmaqOZNbLkYOVlw
hehe. I was just looking at some old stats.
21-22 regular season, 14 dubs over 500 total minutes. Measured by +/- per 48, Kuminga is 13th, Moody is 14th (second to last and dead last). Moody was the only player with negative plus minus overall.
20-21 regular season, 13 dubs over 500 total minutes. Measured by +/- per 48, Wiseman is 13th (dead last).
Let's hope at least one of them makes a run for most improved player!!!