Pulling these Podz thoughts up here, in response the contention below that he’s “way” less athletic than DiVincenzo.
If we define athleticism narrowly as "hops," maybe.
If we allow it to include things like spatial awareness, court vision, coordination, slipperiness, wiggle, feel for the game, etc., I think Podz has some natural advantages over Donte. I think Donte's a bit more robotic/telegraphed in his game than BP (a bit like HB), whereas BP is more naturally fluid and improvisational. It's why I'd argue he has as much Brunson or Manu in him as DDV. Plus, southpaws have a certain sinister, gauche *je ne sais quoi* that we boring, right-minded folks lack.
He also has a streak of Josh Hart, one of the few guys in the league under 6'-5" who rebounds as well as he does (though Podz was the much better rebounder as a rookie).
And as long as we're comparing rookie seasons: it's worth noting that BP was kicking ass in the NBA (as by far the most positive player on a 46-win team) at just 20, an age when Donte, Brunson, and Hart were all still kicking around at Villanova keg parties. Gym rats like BP tend to improve *a ton* between 20 and 25. Heck, the Knicks' 'Nova trio have all improved a ton between age 25 and age 27-28.
Shooting's the biggest question mark with BP, but if he can make strides on that front (as young gym rats often do) his ceiling is *really* high, imo. What's stopping him from being Brunson with much better size, rebounding, and defense?
I think with some growth, Podz is a starter-level player in the league, and a good complement to Steph and Dray. In order to make that work, you'd still need to combine them with a great 3-and-D wing like Herb Jones or OG (or Wiggs from '22 or Klay from '17), and a stretch big at 6'11+ who's not a defensive liability in the paint.
I would agree that his ceiling is high, but I don't think Podz will ever be a plug-and-play star who works in any system, or to whom you tailor the system, but hey, I've been wrong before.
DDV is more athletic, in the way that nearly everyone who scouts the game defines athleticism. He's faster, quicker, and can jump higher. That's all I said. Did it deserve an essay length response, posted twice?
I did not say that DDV was a better player than Podz at age 20, or that Podz can't be a better player. I actually think they have very little in common as players except they are both white guys with reddish hair of similar size who both played for the Warriors, so people inevitably compare them.
> Did it deserve an essay length response, posted twice?
“I disagree” is the response to your specific claim that Donte is the “way” better athlete of the two. (Or at least, I find that definition of athleticism overly narrow).
The rest, if it wasn’t clear, was a more general musing on the upside of Podz, player development, and the ‘Nova trio. Last I checked, long form posts of that sort were tolerated on DNHQ.
I posted it up here (then deleted the other post) for fear that where it might have gotten buried/overlooked where I originally posted it. Last I checked, that was permitted as well.
You can post whatever, you want, and I generally find you insightful. But I'd appreciate it if you cooled it on the passive aggressive form of subtweeting (whatever it's called in a forum like this) and acting like any take that disagrees with your opinions is a personal affront.
What I said, again, is Donte is more athletic than Podz. As this is a basketball message board, and I posted it flippantly in about 10 seconds, I didn't think it was necessary to define athleticism as is generally understood by basketball fans and the way it is almost always used. Note, that I didn't say "DDV is more athletic than Podz in the alternative way that Sleepy Freud defines it in their head."
You're being disingenuous - "if we define it as hops, maybe"... that's not a maybe, that's a yes. But you can't bring yourself to even acknowledge that I'm right about it, in the conventional and widely accepted sense of the word "athletic". A less pedantic response would be "Yes, DDV is more athletic in the traditional sense, but I find that limiting, and here's why..." or whatever.
Maybe you're still salty I don't agree with your take on Ant. Maybe I'm being too sensitive because I don't like your tone and rhetoric style. Either way, keep posting, I don't want to discourage that.
What's stopping him from being Brunson is Steph and the other starters. He would have to be the primary ball handler to make that comparison that is why the DDV comp is apropos. Like you say, shooting is the biggest question mark and that remains to be seen in his development
> What's stopping him from being Brunson is Steph and the other starters.
When he's Brunson's current age, Steph will be 43, so I think we're all good on that front. He has all the time in the world and every opportunity to develop into the player he'll be at his peak.
Brunson's the type of guy who throughout his career has had arbitrary ceilings placed on him — as many have done with Podz — due to perceived lack of physical gifts. And he keeps blowing through them. As noted, even at age 24-25 I don't think anyone saw the current 40 ppg playoff monster coming.
Yeah, that kind of leap is super-rare, but Podz seems to have the super-rare "dog in him" that Brunson does, in addition to better physical tools (basically, size).
As an intermittently wise loudmouth once said: "I don't believe in a ceiling, I believe in a work ethic."
Yeah, but Brunson didn’t have to start his career on a team with a superstar face of the team commanding the full attention and support of the entire organization to maximize his unique abilities.
I like Podz, but to mention him in the same breath with Brunson is beyond my imagination. I'm content with watching him grow. What I'm not content with is the FO and its delusional pursuit of running it all back.
Two very different kinds of games tonight. Pacers-Knicks was anothe frantic wild mad house. I can’t believe what the Knicks can do with half their team on the IL. Donte was flat out amazing, he clearly learned a ton from Steph about shooting. Brunson and Hart had great games. Burks (???!!) was a real contributor - out of nowhere - off the bench. But they are just too short handed. Indiana was super fun as always, but seemed undisciplined and out of control. It was really seeming like they were going to blow it at the end, but Nembhard with the clutch 3 and clearly gassed Knicks allowed the Pacers to hold on to the win. Without the crazy Donte shooting, the next game could be even worse for NY.
Wolves - Nuggets was also bizarre. Or maybe normal. The teams we initially expected showed up. Murray had a great shooting game for once. Jokic started slow but finished strong. Got plenty from the supporting cast. And The TWs just weren’t in the game. Ok defense but intermittent and spotty shooting. Maybe we have a series. I’d like to see a game in which both teams show up!
I'm confused - didn't we all agree a couple days ago that Ant is the next coming of MJ, that Jokic is the most overrated MVP ever, and that the Nuggets are getting swept?
Pulling these Podz thoughts up here, in response the contention below that he’s “way” less athletic than DiVincenzo.
If we define athleticism narrowly as "hops," maybe.
If we allow it to include things like spatial awareness, court vision, coordination, slipperiness, wiggle, feel for the game, etc., I think Podz has some natural advantages over Donte. I think Donte's a bit more robotic/telegraphed in his game than BP (a bit like HB), whereas BP is more naturally fluid and improvisational. It's why I'd argue he has as much Brunson or Manu in him as DDV. Plus, southpaws have a certain sinister, gauche *je ne sais quoi* that we boring, right-minded folks lack.
He also has a streak of Josh Hart, one of the few guys in the league under 6'-5" who rebounds as well as he does (though Podz was the much better rebounder as a rookie).
And as long as we're comparing rookie seasons: it's worth noting that BP was kicking ass in the NBA (as by far the most positive player on a 46-win team) at just 20, an age when Donte, Brunson, and Hart were all still kicking around at Villanova keg parties. Gym rats like BP tend to improve *a ton* between 20 and 25. Heck, the Knicks' 'Nova trio have all improved a ton between age 25 and age 27-28.
Shooting's the biggest question mark with BP, but if he can make strides on that front (as young gym rats often do) his ceiling is *really* high, imo. What's stopping him from being Brunson with much better size, rebounding, and defense?
I love this take. Approved.
I didn’t realize Donte was basically the same size. Slightly bigger
I think with some growth, Podz is a starter-level player in the league, and a good complement to Steph and Dray. In order to make that work, you'd still need to combine them with a great 3-and-D wing like Herb Jones or OG (or Wiggs from '22 or Klay from '17), and a stretch big at 6'11+ who's not a defensive liability in the paint.
I would agree that his ceiling is high, but I don't think Podz will ever be a plug-and-play star who works in any system, or to whom you tailor the system, but hey, I've been wrong before.
That 3/D wing and big are what every team wants more of, regardless of the rest of the roster.
Great post.
Size matters.
Not sure what the exact context is here, but Podz is about the same size as Donte and Hart, no?
Not Hart but Donte yeah.
DDV is more athletic, in the way that nearly everyone who scouts the game defines athleticism. He's faster, quicker, and can jump higher. That's all I said. Did it deserve an essay length response, posted twice?
I did not say that DDV was a better player than Podz at age 20, or that Podz can't be a better player. I actually think they have very little in common as players except they are both white guys with reddish hair of similar size who both played for the Warriors, so people inevitably compare them.
> Did it deserve an essay length response, posted twice?
“I disagree” is the response to your specific claim that Donte is the “way” better athlete of the two. (Or at least, I find that definition of athleticism overly narrow).
The rest, if it wasn’t clear, was a more general musing on the upside of Podz, player development, and the ‘Nova trio. Last I checked, long form posts of that sort were tolerated on DNHQ.
I posted it up here (then deleted the other post) for fear that where it might have gotten buried/overlooked where I originally posted it. Last I checked, that was permitted as well.
Totally agree with your last sentence, fwiw!
You can post whatever, you want, and I generally find you insightful. But I'd appreciate it if you cooled it on the passive aggressive form of subtweeting (whatever it's called in a forum like this) and acting like any take that disagrees with your opinions is a personal affront.
What I said, again, is Donte is more athletic than Podz. As this is a basketball message board, and I posted it flippantly in about 10 seconds, I didn't think it was necessary to define athleticism as is generally understood by basketball fans and the way it is almost always used. Note, that I didn't say "DDV is more athletic than Podz in the alternative way that Sleepy Freud defines it in their head."
You're being disingenuous - "if we define it as hops, maybe"... that's not a maybe, that's a yes. But you can't bring yourself to even acknowledge that I'm right about it, in the conventional and widely accepted sense of the word "athletic". A less pedantic response would be "Yes, DDV is more athletic in the traditional sense, but I find that limiting, and here's why..." or whatever.
Maybe you're still salty I don't agree with your take on Ant. Maybe I'm being too sensitive because I don't like your tone and rhetoric style. Either way, keep posting, I don't want to discourage that.
What's stopping him from being Brunson is Steph and the other starters. He would have to be the primary ball handler to make that comparison that is why the DDV comp is apropos. Like you say, shooting is the biggest question mark and that remains to be seen in his development
> What's stopping him from being Brunson is Steph and the other starters.
When he's Brunson's current age, Steph will be 43, so I think we're all good on that front. He has all the time in the world and every opportunity to develop into the player he'll be at his peak.
Brunson's the type of guy who throughout his career has had arbitrary ceilings placed on him — as many have done with Podz — due to perceived lack of physical gifts. And he keeps blowing through them. As noted, even at age 24-25 I don't think anyone saw the current 40 ppg playoff monster coming.
Yeah, that kind of leap is super-rare, but Podz seems to have the super-rare "dog in him" that Brunson does, in addition to better physical tools (basically, size).
As an intermittently wise loudmouth once said: "I don't believe in a ceiling, I believe in a work ethic."
Yeah, but Brunson didn’t have to start his career on a team with a superstar face of the team commanding the full attention and support of the entire organization to maximize his unique abilities.
Oh, wait…
I like Podz, but to mention him in the same breath with Brunson is beyond my imagination. I'm content with watching him grow. What I'm not content with is the FO and its delusional pursuit of running it all back.
Two very different kinds of games tonight. Pacers-Knicks was anothe frantic wild mad house. I can’t believe what the Knicks can do with half their team on the IL. Donte was flat out amazing, he clearly learned a ton from Steph about shooting. Brunson and Hart had great games. Burks (???!!) was a real contributor - out of nowhere - off the bench. But they are just too short handed. Indiana was super fun as always, but seemed undisciplined and out of control. It was really seeming like they were going to blow it at the end, but Nembhard with the clutch 3 and clearly gassed Knicks allowed the Pacers to hold on to the win. Without the crazy Donte shooting, the next game could be even worse for NY.
Wolves - Nuggets was also bizarre. Or maybe normal. The teams we initially expected showed up. Murray had a great shooting game for once. Jokic started slow but finished strong. Got plenty from the supporting cast. And The TWs just weren’t in the game. Ok defense but intermittent and spotty shooting. Maybe we have a series. I’d like to see a game in which both teams show up!
Nuggets beat the Wolves 117-90. Wolves are up 2-1 in the series.
I think it’s normal for a team to have a mental and physical low after being so high over two games
How much pressure now on the TWolves to win the next game...?
It's the playoffs. There's plenty of pressure on both teams for each game.
Slightly less than on Denver.
After their last two sublime games, Wolves came down (more like crashed) to earth tonight.
Whoa. Nuggets up 93-66 after 3 quarters.
This is one strange series
Series starts when a team wins a home game!
Lakers series was better than this. They’re just taking turns beating the crap out of each other. We might get a close one in Game 6 or 7
gobert should have taken a longer break - he stinks
Murray is the big difference today. He came out to redeem himself.
He should have been suspended, but yeah.
That’s true.
I'm confused - didn't we all agree a couple days ago that Ant is the next coming of MJ, that Jokic is the most overrated MVP ever, and that the Nuggets are getting swept?
Ant is the next coming of Jason Tatum!
Wolves looking like thy can’t hit a barn door today
So back to the old Wolves. Great defense and meh offense.
Nuggets up 56-41 at halftime.
Wolves have been pretty good calling their challenges (and winning).
Nba refereeing from game to game is completely unpredictable- must be frustrating as players and coaches
... and fans
Wolves can’t seem to hit layups or 3s currently
And Jokic isn't even in the game in the 2nd Q!
Nuggets seemed to have bounce back from game 2.
That’s because the refs are calling every ticky tacky foul on the wolves - nba wants a long series
I seriously hate when they do that.
Pacers win 111-106